February 28, 2017
HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY PROCEEDINGS
Vol. XLVIII No. 60
The
House met at 1:30 p.m.
MR. SPEAKER (Osborne):
Order, please!
Admit
strangers.
We
welcome to our public gallery today Mark Brown, Weston Bennett, Constable Bill
Day and Corporal David Smyth who will be the subject of a Ministerial Statement
today.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
As well, we would like to
welcome to the public gallery Patrick Foran, Ane Christiensen and Sharon
King-Campbell who will be the subject of a Member's statement today.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
I would also like to
introduce and welcome two new Pages, Ms. Carmen Thiessen and Ms. Catherine
Bennett.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
Ms. Thiessen is a student at
Memorial University majoring in political science and communications studies.
Ms. Bennett is also a student at Memorial University and is currently studying
commerce.
As well,
we welcome back our returning Pages, Ms. Crystal Snelgrove, Tresha Moorhouse and
Mohammed Ali Bakhshi.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
Statements by
Members
MR. SPEAKER:
For Members' statements today
we have the Member for the District of St. John's Centre, Baie Verte Green
Bay, Lewisporte Twillingate, Fogo Island Cape Freels, Conception Bay East
Bell Island, and Placentia West Bellevue.
The hon.
the Member for St. John's Centre.
MS. ROGERS:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
It gives
me great joy to celebrate Artistic Fraud of Newfoundland as it marks its 20th
anniversary season with a sold-out run of
The Colony of Unrequited Dreams.
Colony was based on the best-selling novel by Wayne Johnston, adapted for
stage by award-winning Robert Chafe and directed by award-winning Jillian
Keiley.
Colony
tells the story of Smallwood's rise to power, the final years of Newfoundland as
a country and the completion of Canada from coast to coast. The material is of
unchallenged relevance within the sphere of 20th century Canadian history.
To mark
Canada's 150th anniversary, Artistic Fraud's
Colony is on tour. Last month it played at Canada's National Arts
Centre in Ottawa earning rave reviews in
The Globe, the Ottawa Citizen and
other national media. The tour continues this month to Halifax's Neptune Theatre
and then onto The Grand Theatre in London. And there will be more.
Twenty-six Newfoundland artists are employed in the production and
Colony will be seen by more than 30,000 theatre goers. Artistic
Fraud is supported by sustaining funds form the crucial Newfoundland and
Labrador Arts Council and the market access component of the Cultural Economic
Development Program.
Bravo
Artistic Fraud, you make us proud! Spectacular!
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for Baie
Verte Green Bay.
MR. WARR:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I rise
in this hon. House today to pay tribute to an outstanding organization: the
Springdale branch of the Women's Institute. This year, the organization is
celebrating its 80th anniversary of community service, and celebrations are
planned for a full year.
I'm
pretty sure the original founders, back in 1937, had no idea that this
organization would survive through a World War, a worldwide economic depression
and a vote on Confederation that made us all Canadian 12 years after they
formed.
In
addition to benefiting its own members, the Women's Institute is a pillar in our
community. The institute makes donations to hospitals, schools and charity
groups across the province. Originally called the Jubilee Guild because of its
focus on craft developments like weaving and leather work, the name didn't
change until 1968.
Working
out of their home at the town hall in Springdale, the Women's Institute
continues to improve the lives of their members and their community. They have
been awarding scholarships to local schools since 1963 and, today, they assist
with the breakfast program at a local school as well.
I ask
all hon. Members to join me in congratulating the Women's Institute of
Springdale on their 80th anniversary. Here's to the next 80 years.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Lewisporte Twillingate.
MR. D. BENNETT:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I rise
in this hon. House to recognize an outstanding volunteer and outdoor enthusiast
from my District of Lewisporte Twillingate: Mr. Chris Vincent.
Chris
devoted his career as being a physical education teacher and retired from the
Lewisporte Academy as vice-principal in 2006. During his career, he was a strong
advocate for promoting physical activity and healthy living, especially to his
students. He served on the Public Library Board, Lewisporte Age-Friendly
Committee and is a founding member of the O2 Athletic Club in Lewisporte.
Chris is
also a devoted kayaker and instructor. This past year, he was recognized by
Paddle Newfoundland and Labrador with the Austin Anthony Making Waves Award for
his dedicated work and promoting safe paddling within the province. Mr.
Vincent's efforts in kayaking and canoeing include organizing the Central
Newfoundland Safety Day, instructing kayaking courses for schools and at the
Women in the Outdoors session, along with delivering presentations to youth at
Loon Bay United Church Camp.
I ask
all hon. Members to join me in congratulating Mr. Chris Vincent on his award,
and thanking him for all his years of volunteer service.
Thank
you.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for Fogo
Island Cape Freels.
MR. BRAGG:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
It's
always a pleasure to rise in this hon. House and inform my colleagues of great
things that happen in my district. February 13 to 19 was winter festival week in
Centreville-Wareham-Trinity in Indian Bay.
Lorraine
Ackerman and her dedicated group of volunteers hosted the 24th annual event. The
naming of their mascot, a snowman, was the buzz lead-up to the event. Willie
Melt will lead the festival for years to come.
Good
fellowship and community spirit was on the menu every day. The week was filled
with good food, good music and an exceptional snowmobile ride through the back
country and I almost forgot, the bingo.
A couple
of weeks ago, the main topic on a local call-in show was: Will rural
Newfoundland and Labrador survive? To that, I say, ask the people of my district
who dedicate their time and very hard work to make every event a success.
I ask
all Members to join me in thanking the Centreville-Wareham-Trinity Indian Bay
festival committee for another successful winter carnival.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay East Bell Island.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. BRAZIL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr.
Speaker, I had the honour to attend an event in my district this past fall that
was about celebrating the accomplishments of students of St. Michaels high on
Bell Island. Only a short few years ago, St. Michaels was labelled as the least
successful high school in Atlantic Canada as it related to academic achievement,
community engagement and social development.
I'm
happy to announce that, as of this school year, St. Michaels has the distinction
of being the most improved high school in Atlantic Canada, a testament to the
administration, teachers, school council, the community, but most importantly,
the students.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. BRAZIL:
The night saw a great
celebration that included all sectors of the community with a slideshow
outlining the school's accomplishments, speeches by dignitaries congratulating
the school, a musical evening that had music for all ages. The entertainment
included country music star Craig Young, Irish traditional band the Punters and
local rock band Beacon Point. A special note of thanks to Bell Island resident
Kelly Russell for organizing this event.
I ask
all Members to join me in congratulating all involved with St. Michaels high on
their accomplishments.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Placentia West Bellevue.
MR. BROWNE:
Mr. Speaker, I rise today
once again to recognize the outstanding success of Canada's national figure
skating champion Katelyn Osmond. I have stood in my place before this hon. House
to celebrate her success before and, today, I do so again and with good reason.
Her career has been remarkable, going from a young figure skater in Marystown to
a strong, young woman receiving professional training in Montreal and Edmonton.
She is a silver Olympic medalist and, as of January, now a three-time Canadian
national champion.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. BROWNE:
Her recent performance at the
nationals in Ottawa was nothing short of a combination of skills, determination
and poise, as she came back with furor and ability after her most recent
devastating injury. Her total point accumulation of 81.01 is a new Canadian
record.
Mr.
Speaker, we all celebrate in Katelyn's own personal success, but we can also
celebrate the fact that thousands of young boys and girls who share her love of
this sport in our province, and indeed across the country, now look up to
Katelyn and say, if she can start on the ice in Marystown and end up at the
Olympics, then so too can I.
I ask
all hon. Members to join me in saying congratulations to Katelyn and all the
best as you approach the Olympics next year.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
Statements by Ministers.
Statements by
Ministers
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Fisheries and Land Resources.
MR. CROCKER:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr.
Speaker, I rise today to recognize a significant advancement for the agriculture
industry.
Earlier
this month, I was pleased to join the Premier and the Minister of Municipal
Affairs and Environment in announcing that additional Crown lands would be
available to the agricultural producers in our province.
Mr.
Speaker, my department has identified 62 areas of interest totalling
approximately 64,000 hectares for agricultural use. To date, 19 of those areas
a total of 15,000 hectares have been reserved for development which almost
doubles the amount of Crown land available for agricultural development. We are
also progressing towards making much of the remaining 43 areas available in the
very near future.
Prior to
making this decision, we consulted with farmers, municipalities and other
stakeholders who are knowledgeable about the industry. Their input was
invaluable.
Mr.
Speaker, this is an important initiative outlined in the
Way Forward: A vision for Sustainability and Growth in Newfoundland and
Labrador. By moving forward with these changes to Crown lands, we are
helping farmers expand their operations; encouraging new entrants to consider
agriculture as a viable career, and advancing food security measures.
Mr.
Speaker, we are delivering on our commitment to increase food self-sufficiency
by at least 20 per cent by 2022.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay South.
MR. PETTEN:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I thank
the minister for the advance copy of his statement. Mr. Speaker, we are pleased
to see additional Crown land being made available for agricultural use. The
minister's word is that we have spoken about this before. In fact, the
recommendation came straight from our 2015 policy blueprint plus it was part of
a review of our Crown lands when we were, the former administration, where it
was part of our plans under the review. Sorry, I lost my train of thought.
We
committed to relax Crown land policies for farm use and to make food security a
provincial priority. It's a great beginning, Mr. Speaker, and we need to see
additional measures.
If the
province is truly committed to helping farmers and agriculture producers take
full advantage of the opportunities to increase local food production, we need
to see one good announcement followed by others.
Thank
you.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for St.
John's East Quidi Vidi.
MS. MICHAEL:
Thank you very much, Mr.
Speaker.
I, too,
thank the minister for the advanced copy of his statement. And this is an
important first step towards greater food self-sufficiency and I'm glad to see
this move. However, making land available without providing sufficient money for
established farmers and new entrants to develop this land is an empty gesture.
The industry needs public investment. It will also need a pool of labour, which
currently does not exist. Government will need to help with this issue as well.
These further actions are essential for the industry to grow.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
Further statements by
ministers?
The hon.
the Minister of Justice and Public Safety and Attorney General.
MR. A. PARSONS:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr.
Speaker, Crime Stoppers Newfoundland and Labrador is celebrating 25 years of
serving the people of our province by working to make our communities safe and
secure. I would like to thank the organization for their dedicated service and
their efforts in gathering anonymous tips to help solve crimes.
This
anniversary is an opportunity to raise awareness of this valuable, collaborative
and community effort, as well as recognize the hard work and dedication of the
volunteers who strive to increase awareness of the program. This is a
community-based organization involving the public, the police as well as the
media. All invest a substantial amount of time and energy to gather important
information to prevent and solve crime.
Mr.
Speaker, there have been over 1,800 cases cleared since this program started,
with over 3,600 charges laid and $9.1 million in goods and drugs seized directly
as a result of the efforts of Newfoundland and Labrador's Crime Stoppers
program.
I would
also like to thank the members of the public who have come forward to offer more
than 36,000 tips to assist in keeping their communities safe. The public's
participation is vital in seeing that those who commit crimes are held
accountable for their actions. Crime Stoppers would not be the success that it
is without the public's assistance.
Mr.
Speaker, Crime Stoppers would also like to remind everyone that if we see
something, say something. And remember, information is provided anonymously.
Mr.
Speaker, I ask all hon. Members of this House to join me in congratulating Crime
Stoppers Newfoundland and Labrador on their 25th anniversary in this province.
Thank
you.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Leader of the
Opposition.
MR. P. DAVIS:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
We on
this side of the House join with the minister and government and the people of
Newfoundland and Labrador in recognizing and celebrating the 25th anniversary of
Crime Stoppers Newfoundland and Labrador, an organization that's done tremendous
work throughout province.
Edmund
Burke said many, many years ago: Evil prevails when good men do nothing. And I
can tell you that crime prevention initiatives and crime protection initiatives
and supports that are provided by Crime Stoppers have spoken, as the minister
has referenced, have been instrumental in solving and supporting the efforts of
those investigating crime and also as a deterrence to crime. That gives people,
good people, an opportunity to assist and support the efforts of our police.
Public,
police and the media working together is proving to be beneficial for
Newfoundlanders and Labradorians. We congratulate all those who've supported
Crime Stoppers through the years.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for St.
John's Centre.
MS. ROGERS:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and I
thank the minister.
How
crucial it is to ensure our communities are safe for all people. Immense
gratitude and congratulations to all those involved with Crime Stoppers 25
years; bravo!
Now,
let's do everything we can to prevent crime, which is often a result of the
problems and challenges surrounding drug addiction. We do need a drug court with
additional treatment and rehab programming. We need more affordable and
supportive housing options and a real comprehensive opioid treatment plan, and
we must act quickly.
Again,
thank you to Crime Stoppers. Bravo for 25 years of dedication.
Thank
you very much, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
Oral Questions.
Oral Questions
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Leader of the
Opposition.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. P. DAVIS:
Thank you very much, Mr.
Speaker.
Mr.
Speaker, here yesterday in the House once again the Premier has clearly stated
there have been no discussions with Quebec regarding hydroelectric developments.
Mr. Speaker, a letter from Quebec, as well as emails, was uncovered through an
ATIPP request that proves otherwise.
So I ask
the Premier: Have you, any members of your staff or any minister responded to
this letter from Quebec Minister Arcand?
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Premier.
PREMIER BALL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Well,
yes, this came up yesterday in the House of Assembly and I did get a chance to
review the email, the letter that had come in from Quebec. Mr. Speaker, no,
there has been no response to that letter. That letter was around the AIT
negotiations that were ongoing, and it was late last May leading up into a
discussion that was going to occur in Whitehorse last year.
Mr.
Speaker, during that meeting, of course, there was significant discussions on
the free flow of electricity to the province. I'm very pleased that during those
negotiations we were able to put in place or we'd be able to negotiate rules
around the free flow of electricity just not through Quebec, but this is a
national item, Mr. Speaker. And we're very pleased to be able to advance this
very important initiative at that table.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Leader of the
Opposition.
MR. P. DAVIS:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Well,
the email trail paints a different picture. The email trail even talks about the
discussion of partnership opportunities. And the letter talks about
hydroelectric development. It's right there in the letter. That very Quebec
letter was also addressed to the Minister of Tourism, Culture and as it's now
called Industry and Innovation, because the department has now taken the focus
off rural development.
I'll ask
the minister of the newly named department: What actions have you taken,
Minister, once you received this letter? What action did you take as a response
to that letter, Minister?
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Tourism, Culture, Industry and Innovation.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. MITCHELMORE:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I will
certainly say that rural development is a priority and a focus of our
government.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. MITCHELMORE:
And, in particular, to the
correspondence that the Member opposite is raising, is exactly what the Premier
is stating. This is correspondence and dialogue as part of the Agreement on
Internal Trade, which is about achieving the free flow of electricity across the
Nation, from east to west, as an energy grid or opportunities that could exist
around the free flow of energy.
And as
Trade Minister, I sat at the table and we entered into a lot of negotiations
around the Agreement on Internal Trade, which has not concluded at this point.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Opposition
Leader.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. P. DAVIS:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
So the
minister is not going to tell us what action he took in response to the letter
or if he took any at all maybe he didn't even respond.
The
Minister of Natural Resources yesterday didn't want to answer when she was asked
if she had shared the letter with the Premier. Now, Minister, we know that you
were very quick to send the contract of former Nalcor CEO up to the eighth
floor. Let me ask you: Why didn't you send the Quebec letter to the Premier's
office?
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Natural Resources.
MS. COADY:
Mr. Speaker, I thank the hon.
Member for his question. Again, this is concerning the Agreement on Internal
Trade and my hon. colleague who just answered the last question, the Minister
for Tourism, Culture, Industry and Innovation was responsible, was the lead on
that file and the letter was addressed to both he and I.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Leader of the
Opposition.
MR. P. DAVIS:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Actually, what the letter was about was establishing, was the intent it was
presenting the letter to signal the interest and the intent to establish a
business partnership between our two provinces is what it says in relation to
future developments in the domain of energy and more specifically, more
precisely, electrical development. It even goes on to say the development of
hydroelectricity. I don't see any reference there to an Agreement on Internal
Trade.
So we
have the letter from Quebec. It was sent to two ministers. It was sent to the
Premier. The Premier denies ever seeing it, even though he was clearly copied on
the email trail. Even it was forwarded to his chief of staff who said that the
Premier had approved the letter being shared with the premier of Ontario.
So I ask
the Premier: Can you explain to us how you approved sending the letter to
Premier Wynne in Ontario when you say you didn't know anything about it?
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Premier.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
PREMIER BALL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I think
what the Leader of the Opposition here, as I tried to explain this to him
yesterday, in context of the negotiations around the Agreement on Internal Trade
that was an agreement not about developments, particularly within Labrador.
Mr.
Speaker, but I will say if, at any point, negotiations would ever start and
they have not. I make that very clear; They have not. I would think that if
there's an opportunity to create economic benefit and, therefore, improve the
social benefits for people in our province, it would irresponsible for me as
Premier not to at least explore those options.
So those
negotiations are not ongoing, I say, Mr. Speaker. But going back to the reason
why the premier of Ontario would have been included in this, of course it was
the Government of Ontario that were kind of holding the pen and leading the
secretary on many of the issues around the Agreement on Internal Trade.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Leader of the
Opposition.
MR. P. DAVIS:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I say
again, the letter is not about the Agreement on Internal Trade. It is not. It
says by the present letter, they're signalling the interest of the Government of
Quebec to initiate discussions means start discussions with the Government
of Newfoundland and Labrador with a view of exploring avenues which allow for
the establishment of a business partnership. And it goes on to talk about future
development: electricity sector; development of hydroelectricity. It's not about
AIT, Mr. Speaker, I'd say otherwise.
As a
matter of fact, the email trail says the same thing. Because it talks about
discussing possible partnership opportunities, et cetera. That means other
things as well. And for the Premier of Ontario, the trail sets out the
discussions were taking place because the Premier of Ontario wanted to see the
letter. She wanted to talk to the Premier of Quebec. She wanted to talk to the
Premier of Newfoundland. That's called discussions, Mr. Speaker.
So I ask
the Premier: come clean with the people of the province and tell us what
discussions are taking place with Quebec?
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Premier.
PREMIER BALL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Well,
coming clean with the people of this province is certainly I've always done,
Mr. Speaker. What this letter is all about is about the Agreement on Internal
Trade, which eventually will be finalized and will become the Canadian Free
Trade Agreement. So, Mr. Speaker, it is being as they say in the legal term
right now, the information is being scrubbed, but what this letter is all about
is about the free flow of electricity through the Province of Quebec.
Mr.
Speaker, that is what that's about. Ontario was involved simply because they
were a big part of the negotiation on the Agreement on Internal Trade, Mr.
Speaker.
I had
meetings with Minister Navdeep Bains on this very issue, Mr. Speaker, as he was
leading some of the negotiations on behalf of the federal government. But I
assure the people of this province, regardless of what the Leader of the
Opposition is saying, regardless of what he wants to believe, this is about the
Agreement on Internal Trade.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay East Bell Island.
MR. BRAZIL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Last
week, the Minister of Education stated, his words: over my dead body would any
other further cuts to teachers' positions happen.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Oh, oh!
MR. BRAZIL:
In a bizarre about-face, he
quickly backtracked on his promise of no teacher cuts.
I ask
the Minister: Which is it?
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Education and Early Childhood Development.
MR. KIRBY:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I said
what I meant, and I meant what I said. I clarified my comments and they were
subsequently backed up by the Premier of the Province, and there's nothing
further I can tell you.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay East Bell Island.
MR. BRAZIL:
So obviously, the Opposition
and the whole of the province heard you change your view on that.
So I
ask: Where you reined in by the Premier's office to change your comments and
come back with something that didn't reflect you standing up for the teachers of
this province? I ask that question.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Education and Early Childhood Development.
MR. KIRBY:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
We are
standing up for educators in this province. As I said, I said what I meant, I
meant what I said. I clarified my comments, and the Premier subsequently backed
up those comments. There's nothing further to add.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay East Bell Island.
MR. BRAZIL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
So in
that vein: Do you stand by your statements that additional cuts would cause
damage that you could not accept as the Minister of Education?
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Education and Early Childhood Development.
MR. KIRBY:
As I said, Mr. Speaker, I can
repeat it again. I said what I meant, I meant what I said. I clarified my
comments. I have nothing further to add. The Premier has added to that, more or
less, repeating what I said. There's nothing further to add.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay East Bell Island.
MR. BRAZIL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
So I ask
the minister: Do you stand by your statement that we cannot take any more
teachers out of the classrooms? What actions are you taking to ensure teachers'
positions are safe and our education system is enhanced?
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Education and Early Childhood Development.
MR. KIRBY:
It's really interesting that
the Member here sat in the House of Assembly when hundreds of teaching positions
were cut in the province in 2013. He never uttered a single word about that at
that time.
Prior to
last year, or the 2015 election, the Premier of the Province, the man who is now
Premier of the Province, said that we would establish a task force on improving
educational outcomes, to do a comprehensive review of the K to 12 system. That
task force has been established. There are four distinguished educators who are
leading that. There have been public consultations all across the province.
Educators, parents, students themselves are participating in the process. We
have gotten very positive reviews on that. We'll get a report on that later this
summer and we'll move from that.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay East Bell Island.
MR. BRAZIL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
So will
the Minister of Education now admit that the 217 teacher positions he removed
from the grades one to 12 school system in September is a major reason there are
so many challenges in our education system this year?
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Education and Early Childhood Development.
MR. KIRBY:
Mr. Speaker, it is evident
that it's not only Ross Wiseman who's challenged by mathematics. The Member
opposite has challenges as well. There are 73 73 positions were reduced last
year. Not the number that he's throwing I think it's a new number he's
throwing around now.
As I
said, we've established the Premier has established a task force which is
reviewing the education system, has a broad mandate to look at important matters
such as inclusive education, reading literacy, math, student mental health and
wellness, a host of other issues. They are doing a comprehensive review. This is
a once-in-a-decade opportunity for people to provide feedback. Once we get
recommendations, we will develop a comprehensive education action plan, which we
said would be put into force in September 2018.
Thank
you.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay East Bell Island.
MR. BRAZIL:
I'm glad the minister brought
up about math because I have to clarify something here. The grades one to 12
system lost 217 teaching positions. He may have replaced the full-day
kindergarten with some additional ones, but the math adds up to 217 positions
lost in the one to 12 system
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. BRAZIL:
is the reason why we have
so many challenges now. Administrators, the NLTA, the school councils
association all have challenges with our education system right now.
So I do
ask the Minister of Education: The province has already taken out as many
education cuts as possible; will you now ensure no more cuts will happen in this
budget to the education system? That's what you're being asked.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Education and Early Childhood Development.
MR. KIRBY:
Mr. Speaker, we don't have a
grade one to 12 education system in this province, and it's shocking that the
Member for Conception Bay East Bell Island would stand here and undermine,
demean and underplay the role played by kindergarten teachers in this province.
I have
been to dozens and dozens of schools this past school year and I've gotten
nothing but positive feedback from kindergarten teachers about the new full-day
kindergarten program that all of the Members of this House of Assembly had
initially committed to, but only the Members on this side of the House of
Assembly saw fit to follow through on.
There is
no one to 12 system. I don't know where that exists, perhaps only in the
Member's mind.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER:
I remind Members again that
the only person that I wish to hear from is the person identified to speak.
The hon.
the Member for Conception Bay East Bell Island.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. BRAZIL:
So the minister admits that
cutting 217 positions out of the school system did no harm and did not
contribute to the challenges that are being identified by administrators,
students, parents, school councils and teachers as having a detrimental effect
on our education system.
So I
want to know, the people of this province want to know, the NLTA want to know,
the parents want to know, but particularly students want to know: What are you
doing to ensure that there are no more cuts to our education system in the
upcoming budget?
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Education and Early Childhood Development.
MR. KIRBY:
Mr. Speaker, if the Member's
genuinely interested in knowing where the challenges in our education system
have come from, he can look at their record in office where they thoroughly
drove this province upon to the rocks, emptied the Treasury. Now, the second
largest expenditure, after health care, in Newfoundland and Labrador today is
paying the interest on the debt that they, mostly, racked up. Education,
unfortunately, tragically, shamefully, today is the third-largest expenditure of
the taxpayers of Newfoundland and Labrador after debt servicing.
That's
their record after 12½
years in government.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay East Bell Island.
MR. BRAZIL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
My
conversations this past week with the NLTA representatives, with student
councils, with administrators, is all about what is this present Minister of
Education, who's been there since 2015 and has been the critic for four years
prior to that, going to do to ensure the quality of education in this province
doesn't drop off like is being indicated now because of the cuts that were made
in the last budget.
They
want to know what is your plan. We know there's never been a plan about what you
did in the last budget. Let's hope you have a plan in the next budget to improve
our education system. Share it with us, please.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Education and Early Childhood Development.
MR. KIRBY:
I'm not sure there was a
question there, Mr. Speaker. I guess I've been invited to provide a response to
whatever that was.
Mr.
Speaker, I've said a number of times now the Premier has appointed a task force
on improving educational outcomes. The intent of that task force is to provide
feedback to the province and we will then issue an education action plan, with
funds supporting that, for the September 2018 school year.
That
task force is made up of distinguished educators from the province. They have a
broad mandate. They are looking at inclusive education, mathematics, early
learning, literacy and reading, inclusive education, as I said, multicultural
education, Aboriginal or Indigenous education and co-operative education. They
have a number of things they are looking at. They'll report back this summer.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay East Bell Island.
MR. BRAZIL:
So my question here is: Will
the minister confirm that he will go to bat for the education system in this
province, and the teachers of this province, and ensure there will be no more
cuts to teacher allocations in the upcoming budget? That's what the educators in
this province want to know, it's what the parents want to know, it's what the
taxpayers want to ensure we have an education system that works for the students
of this province.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Education and Early Childhood Development.
MR. KIRBY:
Mr. Speaker, I've been going
to bat for educators in this province in this Chamber since 2011 when I was
first elected, and far before that, if that's a surprise to the Member. We have
implemented a number of the promises we made in the election campaign, including
full-day kindergarten. We brought democratic decision making back to the people
of Newfoundland and Labrador by allowing them to elect their own school board
trustees. The Premier had committed to establishing a task force; we have done
that.
So we
are doing everything that we can with the mess that we've been left with by the
previous administration to improve education in this province. If the Member has
substantive recommendations, other than the rhetoric that he is offering us, if
he has substantive recommendations, we're all ears over here.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay South.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. PETTEN:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr.
Speaker, last week's restructuring by government saw a complete dismantling of
the Department of Environment and Climate Change, with bits and pieces being
divvied up into multiple departments. I ask the former minister of the
department, now the Minister of Service NL, how do you feel about your
government's decision to wipe out that department?
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Service NL.
MR. TRIMPER:
Thank you very much for the
question.
I guess
what I could say is that I have the full confidence of the Minister of Municipal
Affairs and Environment, the Minister of Fisheries and Land Resources and other
Members of my Cabinet to ensure that the responsibilities that I had will
continue to be followed by this government.
Thank
you.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay South.
MR. PETTEN:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
As an
environmental scientist, with 30 years' experience, the former minister of
Environment and Climate Change is well suited for this portfolio. Many see his
removal from this department as a demotion.
I ask
the Premier: Did you move the former minister of Environment from that
department because he stood up to the federal government and said he was
railroaded by Prime Minister Trudeau on the carbon tax issue?
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Premier.
PREMIER BALL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Absolutely not. I have full confidence in the Minister of SNL right now. I have
confidence in all the Cabinet Members that we have here with this government,
Mr. Speaker. Right now, you know, the current Minister for SNL is still
responsible for a very important committee that's put in place around
methylmercury, as an example, related to the Muskrat Falls Project and the
indigenous communities within Labrador.
We will
always rely on the expertise that we have within his environmental expertise, as
he does a great job as Minister of SNL, like we would every single minister that
we have in this Cabinet.
This is
a team effort over here, Mr. Speaker, and we must check our egos at the door. He
is doing a great job in the Department of SNL, just like he did in his position
as the minister of Environment.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay South.
MR. PETTEN:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
It's
great that the Premier has confidence in him, yet he stripped him of his
responsibilities with the Department of Environment and Conservation or
Environment and Climate Change.
The
recent restructuring of the Office of Climate Change saw the office being moved
to Executive Council, yet the minister responsible is the Minister of Service
NL. So which agency is the lead on this file?
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Premier.
PREMIER BALL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
First of
all, I want to make a comment about the revolving door that we saw in the last
administration, where we saw Finance Ministers come and go. We saw four or
like we did the Premier's office I would say, Mr. Speaker.
Mr.
Speaker, I want to say right now, I'll just reiterate one more time. I have
confidence in every single minister that we have here.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
PREMIER BALL:
The Office of Climate Change
right now in the Executive Council, we have just finished the Pan-Canadian
Framework on Climate Change and the former minister for environment will still
be an active participant in climate change in this province.
The
reason why it's in Executive Council right now, because climate change, and
where this will go in the future is a span and a lens that we need to see on
every single department, Mr. Speaker, and I will reach out to any minister that
has an expertise in any field for their advice on any issue that we face.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay South.
MR. PETTEN:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I guess
he's going to move everything up to Executive Council now. I guess that's the
plan.
This
Liberal government accepted Ottawa's decision to impose a price on carbon by
2018, a new tax. And now the Premier acknowledges that a lot of work needs to be
done to update the province's climate change plan.
Why did
you choose now to take the Office of Climate Change away from the minister
responsible for it and qualified to do it?
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Premier.
PREMIER BALL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Well, I
can tell you in that question there was a lot of misleading information because
it's not accurate at all, I say, Mr. Speaker. The Office of Climate Change, Mr.
Speaker now, climate change impacts our province and, indeed, it's a global
issue that many countries are facing right now.
You
know, the former minister, who led the negotiations as fed into the Pan-Canadian
Framework, Mr. Speaker, will always be a part of what happens. But through that
framework negotiation, we were able to take any revenue from climate change or
carbon tax to put that into the general revenue and we could spend it at the
discretion of the Province, I say, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay South.
MR. PETTEN:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
This
restructuring is causing confusion. For example, Mistaken Point is the first
provincially-managed World Heritage Site in the province. Concern is being
expressed that the world is coming and we're not ready.
Which
minister is responsible to ensure that we're prepared for the influx of tourists
and visitors expected at Mistaken Point this year?
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Tourism, Culture, Industry and Innovation.
MR. MITCHELMORE:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
As the
Minister responsible for Tourism, we're always engaged with all the stakeholders
on the ground and we'll be working to make sure that we're promoting and
attracting through our ads and marketing, and through our initiatives to the key
attractions and the anchor attractions that we have in Newfoundland and
Labrador. And it's quite pleasing to see as well that the federal government has
placed Mistaken Point on one of our postage stamps as well.
You
know, there's a lot of things and a lot of recognition, and we're going to be
working with the committee and with the entity on regional and rural development
matters, as well around how we can provide and enhance the services around the
community and the business opportunities that exist and other tourism synergies
beyond this 565 million-year-old UNESCO site where life got big.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay South.
MR. PETTEN:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr.
Speaker, I ask the minister: What have you done to date to meet the UNESCO
obligations that's required from your department?
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Tourism, Culture, Industry and Innovation.
MR. MITCHELMORE:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Any
obligation that has been required by our department, we're living up to that. We
are certainly meeting with steering committees; we're engaged in that process.
The former Minister of Environment and myself actually, we were at Mistaken
Point in Portugal Cove South when this announcement was made and celebrated with
the community and the accomplishments. There's a team of people who are working
with the community and the stakeholders to ensure there is compliance and that
we live up to our obligations to advance UNESCO.
UNESCO
is a very prestigious status when it comes to the four that we have here in
Newfoundland and Labrador. We've been working with Parks Canada as well because
they've been managing the other UNESCO sites and we've seen significant
investments. Just recently, we invested in Red Bay and way finding and helping
out the community there.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for St.
John's Centre.
MS. ROGERS:
Well, Mr. Speaker, what a
difference a day makes. Now that the Minister of Tourism, Culture, Industry and
Innovation has reinstated the word culture
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MS. ROGERS:
the arts and heritage communities have two other crucial and reasonable
requests. Mr. Speaker, the cultural industry represents a sustainable, renewable
growth industry worth $455 million.
So I ask
the minister: Will he reinstate the positions of directors of arts and director
of heritage and ensure that they are filled by recognized, qualified arts and
heritage professionals?
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Tourism, Culture, Industry and Innovation.
MR. MITCHELMORE:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
And this
department and this government recognize the value of culture. I've always
stated in terms of culture, in terms of the economic value of culture is $450
million, in GDP there are about 5,000 jobs. And we invest heavily through our
cultural programs of $18.2 million, and we'll continue to work with the arts
community and the cultural community on a number of initiatives.
One
thing we will not do, though, at this point in time, given the difficult
decisions that government had to make with the flatter, leaner management and
the reductions of management positions is get into any specifics about any type
of position that would be impacted, out of respect for the employee. So I ask
the member to consider that when framing her questions.
Thank
you.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for St.
John's Centre.
MS. ROGERS:
Well, Mr. Speaker, his
flatter and leaner plan in fact ignores the need for an advocate where decisions
are made in the area of arts and heritage.
Mr.
Speaker, I ask the minister: If he values our artists and their work so much,
will he guarantee funding for the creation phase of their work to the national
average within four years so our artists in Newfoundland and Labrador have
access to funding to at least the same level as their counterparts in the rest
of Canada?
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Tourism, Culture, Industry and Innovation.
MR. MITCHELMORE:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I
respect the Member opposite's question. When it comes to funding for the arts,
we certainly contribute as a government, even in very difficult financial times,
to the tune of $18.2 million in the Tourism and Culture division of the
department. But we also recognize the value and the accolades that our arts and
cultural community are achieving and we do work with them quite significantly on
a number of internationalization projects, on ways of which they can export.
We're
really excited that we're advancing the status of the artist legislation. We're
engaged with the arts community. We've had over 250 people engaged in that
process. It's providing a lot of feedback, and this is where we're going to be
getting more information. As well, as we renew our cultural plan, we'll work to
our best abilities to provide for the arts community in terms of funding.
Thank
you.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for St.
John's East Quidi Vidi.
MS. MICHAEL:
Thank you very much, Mr.
Speaker.
Well,
the word culture may be back in the department's title but the term rural
development has been dropped, just as rural Newfoundland and Labrador faces dire
scientific advice on disappearing crab and shrimp stocks.
I ask
the Premier: What is his government's plan to keep rural Newfoundland alive and
well?
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Premier.
PREMIER BALL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Well, we
spend obviously a lot of time in rural Newfoundland and Labrador. It's a big
part of my own district, so we're very concerned. And I would welcome the Member
opposite to visit rural Newfoundland at any time.
There
are lots of great things to see around our province, Mr. Speaker. It was
mentioned just a few minutes ago, about making Crown land accessible for
agricultural development. It's a big part of an initiative that over the years
many municipalities, the agriculture industry, the aquaculture industry, it's
all about rural Newfoundland and Labrador, investment in tourism I say, Mr.
Speaker. These are all initiatives that we have put out there. Already, in just
our first year in office, Mr. Speaker, we are making a significant difference in
rural Newfoundland and Labrador, but indeed the whole province as a role.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for St.
John's East Quidi Vidi for a quick question.
MS. MICHAEL:
Thank you very much, Mr.
Speaker.
Well,
we've heard that positions have been eliminated in the department.
So I ask
the Premier: If this is the case, who is going to implement his so-called plan
to revitalize rural Newfoundland and Labrador and keep it alive and well, as
he's saying they're doing, which they're not?
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Premier.
PREMIER BALL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Well,
the Member opposite said that she heard well, Mr. Speaker, we held a press
conference last week where we outlined what the plan was. Many positions still
exist in rural Newfoundland and Labrador. As a matter of fact, Mr. Speaker,
these were management positions that were taken out last week to create many
efficiencies, but we've also made significant investments into the areas where
those efficiencies will be used to generate activity in rural Newfoundland and
Labrador.
Mr.
Speaker, the other thing about all of this is this is a province, Newfoundland
and Labrador, that has a rural component as larger communities. Mr. Speaker, we
will not give up on any of those areas of this province and we will do the best
job we can to create employment for Newfoundlanders and Labradorians.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The time for Question Period
has expired.
Presenting Reports by Standing and Select Committees.
Tabling of Documents.
Tabling of
Documents
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Finance and President of Treasury Board.
MS. C. BENNETT:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Pursuant
to section 26(5)(a) of the Financial
Administration Act, I am tabling six Orders-in-Council relating to funding
pre-commitments for the 2017-18 to 2022-23 fiscal year.
Thank
you.
MR. SPEAKER:
Further tabling of documents?
Notices
of Motion.
Answers to Questions for which Notice has been Given.
Petitions.
Petitions
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Opposition
House Leader.
MR. HUTCHINGS:
Thank you, Mr.
Speaker.
I'm pleased to rise today to present a petition: To the hon.
House of Assembly of the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador in Parliament
assembled, the petition of the undersigned residents of Newfoundland and
Labrador humbly sheweth:
WHEREAS Budget 2015
announced a new school for the Witless Bay-Mobile school system; and
WHEREAS the planning and design of this school was underway,
which recently Statistics Canada has recognized the region has having
significant growth; and
WHEREAS the project was cancelled in
Budget 2016;
WHEREUPON the undersigned, your petitioners, humbly pray and
call upon the House of Assembly to urge government to reverse its decision and
construct the proposed school for the Witless Bay-Mobile school system announced
in 2015.
Mr. Speaker, the region from Bay Bulls to Bauline, or
Bauline East as it's often referred to, has seen significant growth over the
past number of years. Dating back to our time and our administration, we had
recognized that and certainly planned to meet the needs of St. Bernard's, which
is K to six, and the young families and young kids and young children we're seeing coming through.
With
that, we had built on two additional classrooms. As well, over those years, had
added portable classrooms which would be temporary in nature and would see a new
middle school built as we saw in a 2014 consultant's report of BAE-Newplan,
which quite clearly indicated, looked at the options of what would be the best
options to pursue, whether extensions or rebuilds on St. Bernard's or Mobile
high. It quite clearly indicated the best result was a new middle school,
something along the lines of grades five to eight, which would basically take
the pressure off St. Bernard's and as well take the pressure off Mobile high as
those numbers flow through.
This was
very clearly indicated based on that consultant and that documentation that was
paid for, obviously, by the prior administration. And based on that and the
history and what we saw in 2015 budget, allocations was made for the building of
this new middle school.
Now,
unfortunately, in 2016, the current administration cancelled that, and I have
written, certainly, the Newfoundland and Labrador English School District, the
chair, cc'd the ministers and others involved, emailed the English School
District as well looking for details on the rationale for a proposal that we
have very little details on putting an extension on Mobile high of nine
classrooms.
But no
one seems to be able to tell us how that's going to deal with the numbers and
what we're seeing coming through in St. Bernard's in the K-6, and how that's
going to be fiscally, I think, prudent in regard to looking at the long-term
solution and how we meet that solution through what's being proposed. Which
again, there's no detail, very little information.
I wrote
on January 5, documentation here, looking for those details. To date, we do not
have them. I know the parent community, the community in general, the
municipalities, the local service districts are extremely concerned and it's
time for the government to move on this, reconsider and address the education
needs that have started in prior years and need to be concluded with the new
middle school in that region.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for St.
John's East Quidi Vidi.
MS. MICHAEL:
Thank you very much, Mr.
Speaker.
To the
hon. House of Assembly of the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador in
Parliament assembled, the petition of the undersigned residents humbly sheweth:
WHEREAS
Newfoundland and Labrador has the greatest percentage of the workforce earning
the provincial minimum wage in Canada, with women, youth and those from rural
areas making up a disproportionate number of these workers; and
WHEREAS
minimum wage earners do not earn enough money for the necessities of life; and
WHEREAS
government ignored the recommendations of its own 2012 minimum wage review
committee;
WHEREUPON the undersigned, your petitioners, humbly pray and call upon the House
of Assembly to urge government to implement the recommendations of the 2012
minimum wage review committee and legislate an immediate increase in the minimum
wage to reflect the loss of purchasing power since 2010 and an annual adjustment
beginning in 2015 to reflect the CPI.
And as
in duty bound, your petitioners will ever pray.
And
while it's been a while since people signed this petition and sent it in, Mr.
Speaker we had so many petitions on minimum wage, it was hard to keep up with
them it is very timely for us to still be presenting the petitions as they
come in because of the fact that government finally is looking at the minimum
wage and does have consultations going on in the province, and looking at the
whole need for indexation. But the problem is that the workers of this province
have lost so much over the last years without any raise that if we just index on
where they are now, they'll never make up their loss.
So
indexation in and of itself is not sufficient at the moment. And, as this
petition asks for, it asks for the wages to be brought up to make up for the
loss and then do the indexation on top of that. But I think it's important to
look at who are the minimum wage workers in Newfoundland and Labrador. We
certainly know that the majority are women. Approximately 66 per cent were
female in 2015 when a survey was done. We had 12,800 minimum wage earners in the
province, Mr. Speaker.
We also
have a high number of youth; 50 per cent of those workers were over the age of
24 years; almost 40 per cent between the age of 25 and 54 years; 49.5 per cent
were between five and 24 years. That's really quite frightening with the
majority over 19, but we have young people working without any hope; 51 per cent
worked full-time minimum wage jobs 51 per cent; over 75 per cent had a high
school education or better, with 44.9 per cent having some form of
post-secondary education. And they go into post-secondary education hoping that
it's going to make life better for them, and here they are working for minimum
wage; 66 per cent of minimum wage workers were in permanent jobs, while 51 per
cent were full-time.
A
serious issue, Mr. Speaker.
Thank
you very much.
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for Cape
St. Francis.
MR. K. PARSONS:
Thank you very much, Mr.
Speaker.
To the
House of Assembly of the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador in Parliament
assembled, the petition of the undersigned residents of Newfoundland and
Labrador humbly sheweth.
WHEREAS
the recreational ground fishery is part of our culture, history and heritage;
and
WHEREAS
the federal government is proposing a tag system for the recreational ground
fishery in 2017; and
WHEREAS
participants have to purchase a licence and purchase tags in order to
participate in the recreational fishery;
WHEREUPON
the undersigned, your petitioners, humbly pray and call upon the House of
Assembly to urge the federal government not to implement a cost or fees to those
participating in the recreational ground fishery in 2017.
As in
duty bound, your petitioners will ever pray.
Mr.
Speaker, in the last Assembly I got up several times and spoke on the importance
of this and the importance of us being able to have the right to go and catch a
fish. Today, we understand there's a lot of crisis in the Newfoundland and
Labrador fishery, a lot of people are really, really concerned about it.
You
know, the fishery is such an important part of who we are as a people. It's
important that we get treated fairly and that Ottawa understands our concerns.
Sometimes if you look at what's after happening with the consultations that
happened on the ground fishery, I know the MP for Central Newfoundland had
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Oh, oh!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for Cape
St. Francis.
MR. K. PARSONS:
Thank you very much, Mr.
Speaker.
It's a
job to hear in here.
Again,
Mr. Speaker, I was talking about how the MP for Central Newfoundland and Grand
Falls had some consultations out there because he wanted to see how people felt.
He himself has urged the federal government not to go along with this system;
yet, the minister, our Minister of Fisheries that represents all of Newfoundland
has never came out and said he supported or didn't support the recreational
fishery with the purpose of tags being implemented. I think it's our right to be
treated like everybody else in Canada. There's no tag system anywhere else in
Atlantic Canada nor should there be in Newfoundland.
Last
year, I applaud the federal government. I applaud what they did by increasing
the number of days we could get out there and the weekends. And that was
basically due to safety issues, because sometimes we understand that the weather
here in Newfoundland is not always able to get out and be able to go catch a
fish. So they extended it, and that was great, but we need this government to
stand up for the people of Newfoundland and Labrador. We need this government to
stand up for the fishers of Newfoundland and Labrador and our whole fishing
industry.
Thank
you very much, Mr. Speaker.
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Conception Bay East Bell Island.
MR. BRAZIL:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
To the
hon. House of Assembly of the Province of Newfoundland and Labrador in
Parliament assembled, the petition of the undersigned residents of Newfoundland
and Labrador humbly sheweth:
WHEREAS
there has been an identified lack of mental health services in our province's K
to 12 school system; and
WHEREAS
the lack is having a significant impact on both students and teachers; and
WHEREAS
left unchecked, matters can, and in many cases will develop into more serious
issues;
WHEREUPON the undersigned, your petitioners, humbly pray and call upon the House
of Assembly to urge government to increase mental health services and programs
in the province's K to 12 school system.
And in
duty bound, your petitioners will ever pray.
Mr.
Speaker, as we've been debating in this House over the last year or so about
cuts to our education system and the need to invest in young people,
particularly as we also address some of the other social issues that young
people face, and all those young people face them in a confined situation and a
confined environment, being our school systems.
With
blended classrooms, with cuts, with teachers, with not having access to other
types of programs, that's added stressors. With the general concept that young
people are facing in today's society, one of the environments where we have an
opportunity because we have a captive audience to not only address the issues
that they face within that system, particularly those related to mental health,
but the other ones that they may face in society.
We've
gone a long way in identifying bullying. We've brought in the private sector to
work with us. The corporate world has supported it, the volunteer sector has
done it, the administration have done it, the parents have done it; but,
particularly, teachers and students have engaged how we address one particular
issue around mental health. And that is around bullying. It's one of the key
components of how we address it.
There
are a multitude of other mental health issues that within the school system we
need to be able to have supports. Teachers have identified it, around students
as part of our integration program and the extra supports that are needed.
Challenges from the home environment that carry over into the school environment
have an impact on the mental health of a young person. It has an impact on the
mental health of the friends of a young person, as they see the stresses their
friends are under. And that has a negative impact on them.
There's
an anxiety issue here. We've seen some challenges around questions in the school
system about not being able to get out for recreation purposes and the impact
that has. For kids who are overly active, who need to be able at times to get
their energy levels out. That adds to the mental health within that classroom.
We need
to be able to support the education system so it ensures that the environment
is supposed to be a safe, engaging, happy, learning process. But if we have
challenges, particularly around those related to mental health, if there are
anxiety issues, if there are self-esteem issues, if there are issues around kids
not being open, if there are issues around kids having behavioural issues and
lashing out, all of those are related to supports that can be addressed through
some other means of mental health interventions.
And in
some cases, we need to be able to put the resources into the administration, the
educators, the parents, the volunteer groups that work within the school system.
I do ask and encourage the government the federal government are coming down
and initiating monies around mental health, there's no reason we couldn't
negotiate a parcel of that to be put in our education system to address mental
health in our education system.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Government House
Leader.
MR. A. PARSONS:
I call Orders of the Day, Mr.
Speaker.
MR. SPEAKER:
Orders of the Day.
Orders of the Day
MR. A. PARSONS:
And I would call Motion 2,
Bill 69, first reading.
Mr.
Speaker, I would move, seconded by the Minister of Health and Community
Services, for leave to introduce a bill entitled, the Health Professions Act,
Bill 69, and I further move that the said bill be now read a first time.
MR. SPEAKER:
It is moved and seconded by
the hon. Government House Leader that he shall have leave to introduce Bill 69,
and that the said bill be now read a first time.
Is it
the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
MR. SPEAKER:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
Motion,
the hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services to introduce a bill, An
Act To Amend The Health Professions Act, carried. (Bill 69)
CLERK (Barnes):
A bill, An Act To Amend The
Health Professions Act. (Bill 69)
MR. SPEAKER:
Bill 69 has now been read a
first time.
When
shall the said bill be read a second time?
MR. A. PARSONS:
Tomorrow.
MR. SPEAKER:
Tomorrow.
On
motion, Bill 69 read a first time, ordered read a second time on tomorrow.
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Government House
Leader.
MR. A. PARSONS:
Mr. Speaker, I call from the
Order Paper, Order 2, second reading of Bill 65.
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Finance and President of Treasury Board.
MS. C. BENNETT:
Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded
by the Minister of Justice and Public Safety, that Bill 65, An Act To Amend The
Financial Administration Act No. 2, be now read a second time,
MR. SPEAKER:
It is moved and seconded that
Bill 65, An Act To Amend The Financial Administration Act No. 2, be now read a
second time.
Motion,
second reading of a bill An Act To Amend The Financial Administration Act No.
2. (Bill 65)
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Finance and President of Treasury Board.
MS. C. BENNETT:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
It's
certainly a pleasure to be back in the House after a break. I really want to
congratulate the House Leader and the team that he had working on the schedule.
Certainly many Members mentioned yesterday how pleased we are to be back in the
House, and certainly this piece of legislation that I have the opportunity to
speak to today is an example of why we should all be proud to stand in this
House.
Mr.
Speaker, Bill 65, An Act To Amend The Financial Administration Act No. 2,
relates to the tabling of Public Accounts. And for those listening at home to
this afternoon's proceedings, Public Accounts really is the financial statements
of the entire consolidated government and when that information is released to
the public.
There
are legislative requirements across many jurisdictions in Canada, including our
own, that dictate when those records are to be presented to the people of the
province through this particular Legislature. And what we're proposing today is
an amendment to those conditions that would ensure that information that needs
to be provided, not only to this House and the representatives in this House,
but more importantly, I would suggest, to the people of the province, happens on
a regular and consistent basis.
Mr.
Speaker, the act will change the required date of tabling of the Public Accounts
respecting a fiscal year to before November 1 in the following fiscal year, and
it will require that in a year in which a general election is to be held in
accordance with subsection 3(2) of the House of Assembly Act, Public Accounts be submitted no less than 15
days before the date fixed for the general election.
And our
amendments also go on that we would require that, in addition to the tabling of
Public Accounts on the required date, where a general election is to be held in
accordance with the provisions of section 3 of the
House of Assembly Act other than subsection 3(2) to (5), an
unaudited financial report on the financial state of the province be submitted
in the same manner as the Public Accounts no less than 15 days before the date
fixed for the general election, unless within three months of the date fixed for
the general election, other indicators of financial state of the province have
been made publicly available.
Mr.
Speaker, this is particularly relevant in light of the financial situation that
we are faced with as a government and the financial situation, more importantly,
that the people of the province find our province in right now, particularly in
light of the history around Public Accounts and when Public Accounts have been
released to the people of the province.
As a
government, we have established a vision of sustainability and growth in this
province, but in order to achieve this we must have a solid foundation in which
to work from, and that solid foundation must be strong fiscal management. As
outlined in The Way Forward,
government must be redefined to address economic, social and fiscal challenges,
and stronger fiscal management is a top priority.
The reason for that is simple, Mr. Speaker, it's to ensure
that the taxes and the revenue that the people of the province are entitled to
see reflected in services is invested and touches those services in the way that
the people of the province expect, and that waste and failure to prioritize is
not something that a government is ever left to not do.
Public Accounts, as everyone in this House should
understand, and certainly those colleagues of mine that sit on the House
committee that reviews Public Accounts would certainly appreciate and I'm sure
the Members opposite who have had the opportunity to not only sit in this House
as elected officials representing districts but also those particularly
who have had Cabinet
positions, would certainly understand that the disclosure of these Public
Accounts in a timely fashion provides for an opportunity for the public to hold
governments accountable.
Public
Accounts is the key accountability to document, which enables the House of
Assembly and its citizens, the citizens we represent, to hold government
accountable for the use of public money. And in an effort to improve the
timeliness of Public Accounts, legislative amendments that I've already outlined
will now require these documents to be tabled on or before October 31 of the
following year.
Mr.
Speaker, I think it's interesting. You know if you look back, as I have had the
opportunity to do, and as my colleagues have as we were preparing this
legislation, and looked at the history of when Public Accounts had been released
back to 1998, most of the Public Accounts have been released in December,
November and January. And as a matter of fact, the earliest that Public Accounts
was ever released for the fiscal year of '15-'16 was the year that we released
Public Accounts last year on October 19, 2016 the most expeditious releasing
of Public accounts that has happened in over a decade.
Mr.
Speaker, those Public Accounts are crucial for a number of reasons. They are
important because as Members of this House, and certainly members of the public
listening at home would appreciate, that Public Accounts is a key accountability
document which enables, as I said earlier, citizens to hold government
accountable for spending of public money. Those documents and those numbers must
be relevant and they must be timely in their presentation to this House.
And
quite frankly, the relevance of those documents and the relevance of that
financial information diminish with the passage of time. With a legislated
tabling date currently defined as 10 months into the following fiscal year, the
value of the information and decision-making process within government is very
limited and stale dated.
Mr.
Speaker, I think it would also be important for Members of this House to
understand and certainly for those, again, listening at home, that improving the
timelines of Public Accounts is also in line with recommendations from the
Auditor General. In 2013, the Auditor General commented in his management
letter, issued around the 2011-2012 Public Accounts, that the Office of the
Comptroller General should continue with its efforts towards earlier tabling of
the province's financial statements.
It's
interesting, Mr. Speaker, that in the three years following that Auditor
General's report, there was only one year out of those three that Public
Accounts was not released in an early fashion. Interestingly enough, Mr.
Speaker, funny enough, it was an election year. Mr. Speaker, that's one of the
reasons why, as a government, we felt it was extremely important not only to
change the date around the release of Public Accounts to allow this House and
members of the public to have more relevant information when it comes to how
government spends its money, but we also thought it was important to address the
issue of what happens in a situation where Public Accounts and the election
dates somehow collide, and we've provided clarity on what the process should be.
We've provided clarity on ensuring that information is provided to the people of
the province because, quite frankly, they have a right to know.
Mr.
Speaker, as I said earlier, the 2015-16 Public Accounts were tabled on October
19, 2016, which was the earliest date of the Public Accounts, quite frankly,
that had been released in the last 18 years. And given the fact that we have
demonstrated the ability to table the Public Accounts during October, we believe
that the legislative tabling date of October 31, as being proposed in this
legislation, is reasonable and allows for agencies, boards and commissions and
departments to provide the information that is fed into Public Accounts in a
timely and responsible manner.
It also
provides additional clarity for the Auditor General when he's preparing his
review of Public Accounts on our expectations as a government and certainly
allows his office to plan and prioritize work to be able to achieve the review
that he would need to do in conjunction with the work around the province's
financial reporting.
Mr.
Speaker, the advancement of the tabling date of the Public Accounts also
provides for greater consistency with the time period that government entities
are required to prepare their annual report. As Members of this House may or may
not know, the agencies, boards and commissions that are governed under the
Transparency and Accountability Act
are required to present their financial reporting into the Office of the
Comptroller General so it can be consolidated into Public Accounts.
In
accordance with section 9 of this particular act, the annual report shall
include the audited financial statements of the entity. Government entities are
required to make public an annual report on the preceding fiscal year within the
time frame established by Lieutenant Governor in Council. For most government
entities, this is generally within six months after the end of their fiscal
year. As the majority of government entities included within the Public Accounts
for the year ending March 31, this would result in the majority of those reports
now being made needed to be made public by September 30.
So we
will see, as a result of this legislation, some changes in how the agencies,
boards and commissions have to complete their annual general meetings, as well
as releasing of their own financial information. But, again, based on the fact
that this year we were able to get that information out in the earliest time in
18 years, we feel it's a very reasonable expectation for those organizations.
Mr.
Speaker, the early reporting, as I've said, will help enhance the accountability
of the provincial government on the management of financial resources. It will
also ensure that the relevance of the financial information that's contained in
Public Accounts can be properly analyzed by the committee of the House that
reviews Public Accounts, it can be properly used by government in making
decisions and listening to recommendations from officials who are working on
policy and other directional things that government needs to take a look at, but
it also provides clarity to the people of the province when they see the Public
Accounts in a more relevant time frame than has been in the past.
As an
example, Public Accounts in 2012-13 didn't get released until January 14;
2011-12 didn't get released until January 16; 2010-11 Public Accounts didn't get
released until January 6; 2009-10 Public Accounts didn't get released until
January 20.
So, Mr.
Speaker, you can see that there has been historical shift in now moving that
date back to October. And certainly, as we've reviewed a jurisdictional scan of
best practices by other jurisdictions, we felt the date that we were picking,
which is October 31, would provide more consistency with what's considered best
in class and would also provide an opportunity for information not to become
stale dated before it was released. As was the case when we took office in
December 14, 2015, when we had to release Public Accounts for the prior year in
January, 2016.
As I've
said, the Public Accounts for 2015-16 were tabled on October 19, 2016 the
earliest date that Public Accounts have been released in the last 18 years. Once
again, I should take the opportunity while I'm speaking here to thank the staff
within our Public Accounts division, as well as the Office of the Auditor
General for their efforts in this regard. This is no small feat, and there is a
significant amount of work that goes into preparing these documents and I
certainly want to say thank you to those officials as well.
I'd also
like to take the opportunity, Mr. Speaker, to thank the members of the Finance
Department, including the Office of the Comptroller General, as well as the
Auditor General's team, for the work that has been done over the last number of
months on this particular piece of legislation. It is one that we thought was a
high priority last year. Officials worked on it in the department for many
months, looking at, as I said, as an example a jurisdictional scan. I certainly
want to congratulate and thank them for their hard work and their diligence in
providing amendments to the Financial
Administration Act that reflect a commitment to accountability and a
commitment to being transparent with the people of the province.
Mr.
Speaker, the Public Accounts for the year of 2014-15 fiscal year, as I said
earlier, were not tabled until January 26, 2016. This was the latest Public
Accounts had ever been released in the province, and the reason for that quite
frankly, is that the former administration did not release Public Accounts prior
to the election, or during the election when there's a freeze on government
activities, and certainly what I understand is that that information was
available. I can't explain why the former administration didn't release the
information, but certainly our view was that was information that the public
have a right to know. It is our intention to make sure that that happens on a
more consistent and earlier basis.
I'd
remind those listening at home, and Members of this House, that in the 2015-2016
budget the previous administration forecast a deficit of $1.1 billion. Mr.
Speaker, that number was later revised after the election of 2015 by our
government, to be a deficit of $2.2 billion, a doubling of the initial budget
forecast. In fact, the public was not even provided an update on the 2014-15
forecast as part of the highly anticipated but not released fall fiscal and
economic update by the previous administration.
Mr.
Speaker, it is essential that Public Accounts are released in a timely manner,
as this will enhance as I said earlier the accountability of government on
the management and use of public funds and will provide the public and the
people of this province clarity on where the province's financial situation is.
Early reporting also assists in the aligning of resources within the departments
and government entities to ensure that the provincial government's financial
statements are prepared in a timely manner.
In
addition, it will inform the provincial government to make the appropriate
resource allocation decisions based on the financial performance of Newfoundland
and Labrador. In addition, these amendments will include that during years where
the fixed date provincial general election occurs, that Public Accounts will be
released no less than 15 days before the date of the election.
Mr.
Speaker, to explain a little bit more of the thought process behind how Public
Accounts will be released in election years, we wanted to overcome the potential
delays such as the province and the people of the province experienced in the
months prior to the last election. To overcome these delays in the release of
the province's financial statements in the years that coincide with a general
election falling within the month of October, we are proposing that the tabling
date for Public Accounts be further amended to a date, as I said earlier, that
is no less than 15 days before the date of the general election.
Further,
in years in which the general election is a date other than an ordinary polling
day in October, as per section 3.2 of the HOAA, the province will be required to
provide an unaudited report on the financial conditions of the province.
So in a
situation, Mr. Speaker, where the election date is early enough in October that
the Public Accounts would not be completed, there is a requirement to release an
unaudited statement to the people of the province so that they would have
understanding of the financial performance of the province based on the
preceding fiscal year even if the Public Accounts has not been tabled.
The
release of the Public Accounts and other unaudited financial update in advance
of the general election further enhances government's accountability and
transparency to its citizens on the financial management of the province. And
providing a key financial accountability document in advance of a general
election will serve to better inform the electorate.
Mr.
Speaker, the provincial government is taking decisive action to create a
multi-year approach to increase revenues, reduce expenses, eliminate waste and
operate more efficiently and effectively.
The Way Forward outlines the need to further address our new fiscal reality
and to finding short- and long-term sustainable solutions for this province's
finances.
And, Mr.
Speaker, the amendments that we are proposing today provide a level of assurance
to the electorate and the people of the province that the financial statements
referred to as Public Accounts for the province will be released in a timely
manner, regardless of the date of an election, and earlier than they have been
released in some 18 years.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Opposition House
Leader.
MR. HUTCHINGS:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I'm
certainly pleased to rise today to speak to the bill as introduced by the
Minister of Finance. I listened as she presented the bill and went through some
of the issues in regard to the amendments to the
Financial Administration Act and that amendment related to Public
Accounts. As she has said, it will change the date Public Accounts will be
tabled in the House of Assembly. She certainly referenced as well some of the
jurisdictional reviews and scans that were done, and how we would come in line
with many other jurisdictions in regard to this.
The bill
will change the legislative deadline for the tabling of Public Accounts from
February 1 to before November 1. So that means the deadline will be moved up by
approximately three months. Changes are being made for section 60 of the
Financial Administration Act to
accommodate that requirement.
As well,
the minister referenced in an election year, the Public Accounts will be tabled
no less than 15 days before the election date as well. And then in the case of
an election date, which we know is a set date every four years, it's changed;
they're tabled no less than 15 days before an election date, unless in the last
three months the Public Accounts had been released, a Budget Speech has been
delivered, or other financial reports on the state of the province has been
delivered.
I guess
that would reference various indicators, economic indicators that are often
given during the year, but certainly economic indicators are directed or are
recognized at any time in a budget and I guess those are ones the minister
referenced. Maybe further, she could speak to that. Certainly at times during
the budget, the budget documentation, there are often references made in that to
fiscal sensitivities to key assumptions, those types of things.
They
would be related to things certainly that's relevant to us: oil prices, exchange
rates. When those are announced in the budget, certainly as you follow through
the year anybody can do that and recognize where those assumptions are to at
any particular time during the year it gives some certainty and understanding
of what path we're on based on a commodity market, because, as we know,
commodity markets go up and down. Based on that, projections that you make are
best informed by, certainly, experts in the field in regard to what their
predictions on actual commodity prices will be. So I guess that's what she's
referring to, and I'm sure the minister will probably speak to that later in
debate.
So as
well, I certainly want to thank officials too. We had officials from our
department meet with Finance and certainly thank them for going through it and
providing the information they did provide. As was mentioned before the
Comptroller General made reference to other issues before in regard to getting
the information out and as well the minister referenced I spoke to it as well
in regard to jurisdictions and the legislative requirements and what they are
in other jurisdictions in regard to Public Accounts between September and
January. So that's important as well. So I certainly acknowledge the work done
by the minister in regard to doing this review and bringing it forward.
The
Financial Administration Act is
certainly a guiding piece of legislation within the government's financial
branches and, in a broad sense, tells us what we can do, what we can't do and
how expenses are to be processed, things like how funds have to be approved and
those sorts of things. So in many ways the act is somewhat of a rulebook for the
government on how funds need to be accounted for.
And as
the minister references as well, the Public Accounts are the audited financial
statements of the province's finances. It contains information on the previous
fiscal year, certainly budget surplus, deficits and net debt of the province.
It's important to recognize that it's the prior year's fiscal period, so usually
about and it's the audited financial statement of that fiscal year, the prior
fiscal year. Not current, but prior. And that provides information in regard to
that prior fiscal year.
When we
bring down a budget, we know that there are estimates made for current year, but
there are also revisions of the prior year and they're not actuals. We often
refer to them as actuals. They're the estimates and then the revised number is
in the document when a budget is presented for prior year. And then what this
would do to Public Accounts would basically provide the actuals through that
audit.
And
those numbers would be for the prior fiscal year, which are the actual numbers
and what they are after the audit takes place. It wouldn't be current year; it
would be prior year. But certainly very important in regard to establishing what
the actuals were for that particular year based on the budget, based on
revisions, based on what transpired over that period of time. But what the
minister is suggesting here is that period be moved up in terms of that
reporting and when exactly it takes place.
Again,
the main focus of the bill is certainly to do it somewhat earlier. This is
something we're certainly pleased to support on this side, what the minister is
bringing forward. Again, it goes to the issue of openness, transparency and
bringing it forward for discussion to do that. It's consistent somewhat of other
jurisdictions as well, and it certainly goes to the timing of it.
There
are a couple of items in it that I want to acknowledge. I think it's section
60(2) and 60(3) of the bill. The two clauses talk about updated information
about the financial health and status of the province in the public domain in
advance of an election. So it talks about 15 days. I think section 60(2) shall
be laid before the House of Assembly or submitted in accordance with subsection
(4) no less than 15 days before the date fixed for the general election.
I'm not
sure, and the minister can speak to that as well in terms of 15 days, whether
that's viewed as a significant period of time or whether that should be expanded
to be an earlier date than that in terms of getting to predate the election,
time to circulate the information, for it to be certainly consumed by the public
in regard to putting that out. That's up for consideration. As well, section
60(3) that if there was a budget in the last three months references, not the 15
days, but if there's another circumstance that occurs, that would be fine and
met the requirements of the legislation.
Again, I
get back to some of the comments I made earlier in regard to some of the
performance indicators, or economic indicators that are often in a budget when
it's brought down. And those are ones that certainly various groups, economists,
industry groups, various people in society would follow to look at the
performance and what's happening in regard to, as I said, economic indicator and
performance, and performance back to the actual budget and you track that, and
most people do, in regard to it.
I
mentioned earlier, things like the something like commodity markets, whether
it's iron ore, whether it's related to a barrel of oil, whether it's related to
the exchange rate on the Canadian dollar, how our export and how that's changed
and what the difference is in regard to whether the rate goes up or down a cent.
It correlates quite clearly to what the return on a barrel of oil is and gets to
what our projection is in revenue from the production of oil and certainly the
export as well. So those are very important in assessing and looking at the
economic situation.
As well,
some other things I guess the minister may speak to later is in regard to
revenue generation and the period of time during the year that we would get some
information from the end of the fiscal year. Obviously, any budget you would
predict revenue generation, whether that be provincial income tax, corporate
income tax, HST, whether we'd have an overpayment or not, those types of things.
We would
need to have that information from the federal government in regard to what
those numbers would be and then we could put it in because they would be actuals
we would put into Public Accounts, that that information would be available. I'm
sure the minister has checked and within that time frame of, I think, six
months, obviously that information would be available and that would be part and
parcel of the process to make sure we have all the data we need to do the Public
Accounts.
So, in
regard to the piece of legislation, we certainly support it. We recognize the
fact of making information available from roughly nine to six months in line
with other jurisdictions in doing that. Obviously, as I said before, this is the
prior fiscal year in terms of confirming what the actual expenditures were at
that particular time and making it available at an earlier time.
We
certainly support the issue of 15 days prior to an election date. I don't know
what the relevance is of 15 days rather than making it an earlier period and a
greater period of time before that, whether it be 30 days or 60 days. I don't
know if that's possible, but it's just something in reviewing the documentation
that came to mind and why that would be and why we wouldn't be able to expand
that a little further.
Then, to
that point, if there was some kind of fiscal update in an election year, I think
that this 30 days it wouldn't be required to release the accounts within 15
days, but I guess that gets to the point that in recognition there are
indicators during the year that you can follow that would give you the ability
to project where the province is at a particular time based on what the budget
had recommended. And you could follow those indicators, economic indicators,
whether that's commodity prices or other things to be able to determine where we
are at any time fiscally in the province. I guess that's what the reference is
when it's saying the 15 days wouldn't be in effect but you could look at these
other indicators to do it.
So I
thank the minister for bringing this forward. I certainly look forward to debate
in Committee and maybe answer some questions in moving this through the House.
Thank
you very much.
MADAM SPEAKER (Dempster):
The Speaker
recognizes the hon. Member for Labrador West.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. LETTO:
Thank you, Madam Speaker.
It's a
pleasure today to stand in his House to support Bill 65, An Act To Amend The
Financial Administration Act No. 2.
I think
what this bill does is this is probably one of the greatest bills that we'll
ever do to show that we are serious about transparency and accountability to the
people of this province. Because what we saw in the fall of 2015 when our
Premier, then the Leader of the Opposition, tried to get the information, to get
to see the books of this province and we were led to believe with a $1.1 billion
deficit that turned out to be in excess of $2 billion, I think this will go a
long way to avoid that ever happening in this province again.
I think
this is one of the greatest bills that we could probably introduce in this House
or this city. What this does, Madam Speaker, is change the required date of
tabling of Public Accounts respecting a fiscal year to before November 1 in the
following fiscal year.
It
requires that in a year where a general election is to be held, which is what we
faced in the fall of 2015, that the Public Accounts be submitted no less than 15
days before the date fixed for the general election. So that will go a long way
to solving the issues we were faced with when we took office on December 1,
2015.
What
this Public Accounts tabling date does, I guess, as I said, it improves our
accountability, it improves transparency. What it will also do is an earlier
tabling date aligns resources within departments and entities to ensure
financial statements are prepared in a timely manner. What I mean by timely
manner, not only by the date but certainly that the reports when they do come
out at that time, they're relevant, they're up to date, they mean what they say
and we're not led down a garden path of believing that a deficit, or in years to
come a surplus is not what it actually is.
So we
will never face that again. And that was something, as I said, in 2015 that we
were faced with. I think the minister has outlined, articulated quite well, the
advantages of this bill and what it means for us as a province and us as a
government.
When you
look at the record of the past administration in the releasing of Public
Accounts, it's nothing short of dismal I'm being very kind when you look at
the dates that they were released in the past 10, 12 years, it's shameful rather
than dismal.
AN HON. MEMBER:
Shameful.
MR. LETTO:
To see that we had to come
into office, again when we did come into office, the first thing we had to do
was to release the Public Accounts. And to show the real dire situation that we
were left with was amazing and was certainly it came as a surprise to a lot of
people in this province.
It was a
situation that we had to face, and we're dealing with it day by day. For
instance, in the 2015-16 Public Accounts tabled on October 19, 2016, that was
our first our last year's release. It was released in October. And that was
the earliest date that they've been released in the last 18 years.
AN HON. MEMBER:
How many years?
MR. LETTO:
Eighteen.
AN HON. MEMBER:
Eighteen.
MR. LETTO:
Eighteen years.
AN HON. MEMBER:
That's a long time.
MR. LETTO:
Public Accounts, for
instance, for the 2014-15 fiscal year were not tabled until January 26, 2016,
which was the latest tabling since 1998-99. And it was our administration that
ended up doing that, because the previous administration failed to do it before
the election was called.
We did a
number of jurisdictional scans, the department did and I certainly thank them
for doing that. They've done a great job with this bill and putting in place
something that's workable and meets the accountability and transparency
guidelines that we wish to follow as a government.
Eleven
of the 13 provinces and territories have legislative tabling dates ranging from
September 27 to January 31. And of these 11 jurisdictions, six have generally
released their Public Accounts one to two months in advance of the legislative
tabling date. So we were, I guess again, when you look at the provinces and
territories of this country, we were really behind the eight-ball when it came
to releasing our Public Accounts and being transparent.
I think
the greatest asset of this bill is the fact that when we talk about election
years, that we're going to do that before the election date. And again, I have
to go back and say that this was something that really, really put us into dire
straits back in late 2015, early 2016. And in a year in which a general election
is to be held in accordance with subsection 3(2) of the
House of Assembly Act, the Public Accounts will be laid before the
House of Assembly or submitted in accordance with subsection (4) no less than 15
days before the date fixed for the general election.
We know
that we have set dates for elections, but time to time they change, and our
election date is in October, so and as the legislation outlines, October 31 is
the deadline for release, but we know that in an election year that that has to
change, that we have to do it before October 31.
So I
think we've really done our homework on this, and really taken into
consideration any situation that we may be faced as a government by the release
of Public Accounts. That's what I like about this bill, it gives us a
good guideline, and it gives the people of this province a guideline of what our
financial situation is in this province, and we are not faced with the surprises
that we were faced with back in 2015-2016.
So again, I have to commend the department, commend the
minister. I know this is something that we recognized when we took office that
had to be done. And I certainly thank the minister and the department for taking
it on themselves and to get it done early in our mandate. There was a lot of
work put into this, but I think what we've done here is we've laid out a good
foundation for our government of being transparent and accountable to the people
of this province and that's what that's all about, and that's what this is all
about, is being upfront with the taxpayers, upfront this is their money. It's
not our money; it's their money. And they should know where we are in the
financial situation of this province, because they're the people who are paying
into this.
So again, I want to thank the minister, thank the
department, and I certainly look forward to hearing from the Opposition. I
notice that the Member for Ferryland had a few comments about it. And, for the
most part, I think they're positive and they're in support of this. I should
certainly hope they would be. It's too bad they didn't follow it, but glad to
see now that they're supporting this on a go-forward-basis.
We also, you know, we talk about the assumptions and the
estimates that we all go through in our budget process, and this is an
opportunity to put some actual figures to the assumptions that we make, whether
it's the price of oil, whether it's other revenues that the province receives,
at least this gives an opportunity to put an actual face to the assumptions
and either substantiates or amends or revises the assumptions that they're made
at budget time and these are things that we can't predict on a definite basis.
You have to predict certain things when you do a budget, as you would do with
any budget. Not only in government, whether it's your own budget or your
organizational budget, I would say that estimates have to be made; but at least
it puts some actual figures and gives us an opportunity to revise, amend or, at
least, substantiate.
When he
said he supports this bill because what it does is it gives us an earlier
opportunity to do the Public Accounts and get them out earlier. Well, I would
suggest what this does is it improves accountability and it proves transparency
and it puts the onus on us, as a government, to be, as I said, again,
transparent and accountable to the people of this province. That's what this is
all about. It's being accountable and being transparent. Nothing else, and
that's what it's all about.
So,
again, Minister, I thank you and your department for the work that you've done
on this. I think it's a great bill. As I said at the beginning, it may be the
bill that really sets the foundation for transparency and accountability for
this government, something that we're looking forward to doing and something
that we will do for the people of this province.
Thank
you, Madam Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MADAM SPEAKER:
The Speaker recognizes the
hon. Member for St. John's East Quidi Vidi.
MS. MICHAEL:
Thank you very much, Madam
Speaker.
I'm
pleased to take my own turn in standing and speaking to Bill 65, An Act to Amend
the Financial Administration Act No 2. I sort of look at this bill as being
pretty run of the mill; I'm afraid I can't get as excited about it as my
colleague for Labrador West just got. I think it's good. I am not saying
anything against it. I'll be voting for it, absolutely, and I think it's good to
get the Public Accounts out in a timely fashion, very definitely. I think the
whole province would definitely say yes to that and when we know that there's an
election coming up, I think it's good to have the Public Accounts out before the
election also.
I'm not
sure what difference it will make 15 days before an election, but the thing is
when it comes to the overall financial picture of our province, we may not know
details that will come out in the Public Accounts, but I think we all will have
a fairly good sense at any time what's going on. In 2015, for example, I would
point out that we all knew we were in a pretty bad state, financially. And it
was no surprise to anybody in the province, I don't think, at all, because we
all knew what was happening to the price of oil. We all knew what was in the
budget. We all knew everything that we had to deal with in this province. So I
sort of smile when I hear the government say that they were surprised, that they
didn't know the state we were in, because everybody else in the province knew
the state that we were in. And that's the reality.
However,
having said that, I'm certainly supporting this. I'm glad that this has been put
in place. I'm certainly not saying no to it. But let's not make more of it than
it is. I see a lot of political posturing going on here over this bill today,
and I'm not going to take more time just to do political posturing. It's a good
thing to do and we'll be voting for it.
MADAM SPEAKER:
The Speaker recognizes the
hon. the Member for Stephenville Port au Port.
MR. FINN:
Thank you very much, Madam
Speaker.
It's
certainly great to stand and add to the debate here today. I'm very pleased to
see this bill introduced from the Minister of Finance and President of the
Treasury. Very interesting to listen to her commentary as well, and to put
things into perspective as to where we have been previously under former
administrations, a significant amount of time, at which no one was entirely
aware of where our Public Accounts were.
I'm not
sure I'm on the mic here, Madam Speaker.
AN HON. MEMBER:
There's no light.
MR. FINN:
No? Here we go. We can start
again.
Thank
you very much, Madam Speaker.
It's
certainly a pleasure to rise and stand here today.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. FINN:
For those just joining us,
who are listening at home or happen to be streaming online, I just wasn't on the
microphone so therefore, for our good folks downstairs in Hansard that take the
notes and record what we state here in the Legislature, I'm certainly now back
on the record.
Today
we're talking about Bill 65. Of course, just our second day into this sitting of
the House of Assembly so, really, this is the first piece of legislation that
we're debating today. And I think the timing of such is particularly important,
that this is the first bill we'll be debating, An Act to Amend the Financial
Administration Act No. 2. Basically, in short order, what we're stating is that
we now need to have our Public Accounts released and we have a date that we have
fixed that they will be released. There's a provision in here whereby if a
general election happens to be called other than a fixed election date, as there
are some circumstances that can happen, we have provisions of which they'll be
introduced no less than 15 days before a fixed general election and/or any other
election for that matter.
And I
think that's important because when you look at what we've been trying to do as
an administration in government over the last year, we looked at some of the
challenges that we face. And perhaps one of the biggest challenges was having a
good, solid understanding of where the province's finances were.
And so,
while we were well aware, for those of us who were running in the last general
election, that the state of the province's finances were certainly very bleak, I
guess to put it bluntly, one thing we were not aware of is what the actual
numbers were. And so we said time and time again in the House and it has been
noted throughout the media and other means that the Premier had written the
former premier and now Leader of the Opposition in September of last year and
was looking for an update as to the state of the province's finances.
At that
time, Madam Speaker, we didn't get any actual answer and we were lead to believe
that there would be a $1.1 billion deficit. Well, it just so turns out that
without any release of Public Accounts by the time we took office and had to
release the Public Accounts correct me if I'm wrong, Minister of Finance. I
understand we released the Public Accounts in January. So that was something
that we had to do that, perhaps, they should have done previously, and we were
now being told and we had to tell the taxpayers of the province: I'm terribly
sorry; the $1.1 billion projection in deficit is actually $2.2 billion.
So when
you talk about being misled, and we're trying to properly plan as to what we're
doing with our taxpayers' dollars, we really didn't have any idea. It wasn't
until we took government that we were able to understand that there was an
additional $1.1 billion in deficit. So yes, we were aware that the state of the
province's finances was very bleak but when you talk about another $1.1 billion
that is certainly substantial.
In
Question Period earlier today there was a question raised, and the Minister of
Education and Early Childhood Development had pointed out to everyone that we're
spending more in terms of our debt annually, right now, than we're spending on
education in this province. And it's ironic that the figure that we're spending
on our deficit is actually $1.1 billion.
Just to
put things in perspective, so we're spending more on our deficit than we are in
education. We take over office and we're lead to believe that there's going to
be a deficit of $1.1 billion and, in fact, it's $2.2 billion. So in an effort to
ensure that any future administration moving forward does not face that same
circumstance, that's essentially what this legislation today here is doing.
We've
looked across other jurisdictions, as noted by the Member for Lab West. This is
being done all across this great country. And provinces are being open and
accountable in letting taxpayers know, and even letting the Opposition know, as
they all have a vital role to play in government and Opposition certainly has
a role to play. So we're talking about letting people know exactly what's going
on with the state of our affairs.
For the
Minister of Finance to get up and have to say that when we released the Public
Accounts, it was the earliest they had been released in 18 years. I mean, that's
certainly astonishing, when you think about it. I think that everybody would
agree, and I'd be shocked if the Members opposite didn't agree either. I don't
know how any particular government when you look across the country and the
provincial governments are releasing their Public Accounts and letting the
taxpayers of the provinces know and letting industry know and letting business
know and letting departments within government know exactly what they can expect
and exactly what the numbers and the state of the province is, certainly
something that's important.
I would
wager to say it's beyond important. It's absolutely paramount that these numbers
be released and everyone, every single Newfoundland and Labradorian in this
province is aware. You can take it a step further, when you look at going to the
bond agencies and the lending markets. I mean, how are we to appear as a
province when we can't even release our Public Accounts figures at a particular
point in time to let everyone be aware of that.
So I
certainly applaud the minister for bringing in this legislation. I'd be
extremely shocked to see any disagreement on approving this legislation. It was
great to hear from the other Member opposite as well, the Member for St. John's
East Quidi Vidi bear with me there lending her voice to it as well, and
certainly they're pleased. Certainly they're pleased with this move by the
Finance Department.
As
stated, 11 of 13 other jurisdictions have tabling dates ranging from September
to January, so there's no reason to think that we can't be prepared to do the
same. Six of these jurisdictions generally release their information a lot
sooner as well.
So
today's legislation is to ensure that we have regular and consistent information
available to folks and everybody can have an understanding, a great
understanding, of where we are. Again, we don't want to see any administration
take over office and form government and have no idea exactly as to what the
state of the finances is. There's no need to be caught off guard. When you talk
about proper planning, you talk about having a plan, you talk about having a
plan in place, how is any new administration going to be able to govern without
knowing the true state of the province's finances? And that was the exact
position that we found ourselves in. It's certainly something you would not want
to leave anyone in the dark on.
As the
Member for Lab West pointed out, it's no different than when you make a budget
for your household. It's almost like a partner, a husband and wife, and the
husband says to the wife well, I'm not really quite sure where we stand but
we'll find out when we go to look at tax time, and be completely caught off
guard and have no ability to plan.
So this
is something that will certainly allow for us, as a government, to plan as we
move forward. And, as I stated, it will give industry, business, those who are
looking to invest in this province, an idea of what they can expect. We'll have
a good understanding as to what we can expect from our lending institutions;
certainly a move to be applauded.
Madam
Speaker, other than that, I don't have too, too much to add. As I say, I can
only give great thanks to the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury. I
look forward to her remarks as we close debate, unless other Members are looking
to lend their voice to this particular piece of legislation today. But I have no
trouble supporting Bill 65.
Thank
you very much for the opportunity to speak to it today, Madam Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MADAM SPEAKER:
The Speaker recognizes the
hon. the Member for Mount Pearl Southlands.
MR. LANE:
Thank you, Madam Speaker.
I'm not
going to take too long, but I did want to say a few words about Bill 65. First
of all, I want to say that I support the bill 100 per cent. As a matter of fact,
it was only two weeks ago that I had a good discussion on the VOCM
Backtalk with Pete Soucy about this
identical issue, actually, as part of a number of reforms that I believe that we
need to bring to this House of Assembly. This was certainly one of them. I
didn't know it was coming here today, but I'm glad that it is and I will be
supporting it, as I said, 100 per cent.
I do
find it kind of interesting, just listening to the Member opposite, and I think
a couple of them mentioned the fact that this is the first time that we've seen
this done in 18 years. I'm not sure why we would want to bring up 18 years. To
my recollection, in math, the former administration were there for 12 years, so
somebody had to be there for those other years prior to them. I think that would
have been a Liberal government. Not that it really matters, but the fact that
we're bringing this little bit of partisan banter into it, I don't know why we
would want to do that.
Also,
the fact that we're talking about the fact that we didn't know prior to the last
election what the deficit really was going to be. There's no doubt that it
wasn't known what the exact numbers were. I think we can all say that would be
accurate. But to suggest there was nobody had any idea, I think that's a little
bit disingenuous; hence, the reason why the Premier wrote the then premier prior
to the election asking for the information, because everybody knew it had to be
higher than what was projected.
All you
had to do was look at the price of oil, the fact it had dropped, and you could
do the math yourself and you would have had an idea that it would have been
worse. Now, did anyone know it would be as bad as it turned out to be? Probably
not. I certainly didn't, and I'm sure nobody did. But, there's no doubt that we
had to know it would have been worse.
MR. LETTO:
You campaigned on it.
MR. LANE:
Now, I say to the Member for
Lab West, we're going to start off this session again. I listened to every word
he had to say, never said a peep. And already now every time you say one thing
that he doesn't like, all of a sudden we got to get into the heckling game.
Anyway,
I'm going to continue on, but I'm not going to be putting up with any heckling.
I'm not going to be putting up with any of this nonsense, and I'll call him out
and anyone else on it every time. I'll respect you; you respect what I have to
say.
Anyway,
moving on, Madam Speaker. I would just say that and especially given the fact
that I'm supporting the bill. But I just think we're getting a little bit cute
by half by some of the statements being made about who knew what and who didn't
know what and so on. I think we all had an idea that it wouldn't be as bad; that
it would be worse than what was put out there originally, but we didn't know how
bad.
The fact
of the matter is we're doing the right thing now, and that's the important
thing. We're doing the right thing now. They're bringing forth a piece of
legislation that basically, when enacted, is going to provide the people with
the accurate information prior to the election, and I think that's very
important. That way we eliminate all the mystery, we eliminate all the excuses,
and when a party brings forth a platform in future elections, everybody will
know, including, and most importantly, the general public will know exactly
where we stand and then they can gauge the promises contained in all the party
platforms and line it up against what people know the financial situation to
actually be.
That way
the people can hold all of the parties accountable. They can ask questions. They
can question if you're planning on doing this, how do you plan on achieving it,
given this particular situation? Where do you plan on finding the finances to do
this or if you're going to do this over here, where are you going to take from
in order to do it? Please explain, because based on the financial situation, I
don't understand how you could propose this particular thing, whatever it may
be.
So it
makes good sense. It's a proactive thing to do. It's a positive thing to do. I'm
glad it's being done and I will support it 100 per cent.
Thank
you, Madam Speaker.
MADAM SPEAKER:
The Speaker recognizes the
hon. Member for Bonavista.
MR. KING:
Thank you, Madam Speaker.
It's an
honour to stand here today in the spring session to speak on Bill 65, on the
Financial Administration Act and
changes that we're making to it. I'm also looking forward to speaking to Bill 66
when I get an opportunity because it's heavily related to the District of
Bonavista.
With
that said, my friends from Lab West and Stephenville Port au Port and even
Mount Pearl Southlands have made some very good points about having this
information out here.
AN HON. MEMBER:
What?
MR. KING:
I'm willing to give credit
where credit is due.
MR. KENT:
Hear, hear!
MR. KING:
They made some very good
points about the minister's statement about releasing Public Accounts 15 days
prior to an election. Like they said, it is for accountability and transparency
so the public are not surprised, or to coin a phrase from my friend from Mount
Pearl North or excuse me, Mount Pearl Southlands yesterday, hoodwinked by
what they see or what they're being told by the governing party at the time.
This is
a big step forward, and like I said, goes a long to creating transparency and
accountability; two things we campaigned on in the fall of 2015. What this also
does is it brings us in line with other jurisdictions. So you have a number of
different provinces right now who release their Public Accounts in the fall of
the year, and this year being a record for us within the past 18 years,
October 19, 2016. The previous year, because the previous administration didn't
release the documents, our government had to release it in January 2016 at a
deficit two times greater than what was projected in Budget 2015.
What
this does as well, by releasing the Public Accounts earlier in the year, and I'm
a member of Public Accounts Committee, so it allows myself and my colleagues on
the Public Accounts Committee to get to work and do things a little bit quicker.
What it does, you see here, the Auditor General's report, it allows the Auditor
General to take the Public Accounts, go through it, highlight things that stand
out to him which aren't good for the public and the taxpayer of Newfoundland and
Labrador.
So once
we get that report, once that report is released, we take a look at it for
Public Accounts and we actually work with departments and agencies and entities
to make sure they are doing things correctly, using taxpayer monies properly
going forward. So what this does, you get this out earlier, it allows the
Auditor General to get his report out earlier and allows us, as members of the
Public Accounts Committee, to get rolling on things to make sure public tax
dollars are spent wisely and correctly.
With
that said, I'm fully in support of this. I think everything's been stated over
and over again. I don't want to take anyone's time and repeat things. But on the
like I say, the 15 days prior to an election, a big step forward. Getting it
out earlier helps me do my job as a member of Public Accounts and it makes the
public aware of where their tax dollars are going.
With
that, Mr. Speaker, I'm going to sit down.
Thank
you.
MR. SPEAKER (Warr):
The hon. the Member for Cartwright L'Anse au Clair.
MS. DEMPSTER:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
And I'm
just going to stand for a couple of moments find my notes here, caught off
and speak to Bill 65, An Act to Amend the Financial Administration Act No. 2.
I should
say, since this is the first time on my feet since we've opened the House only
yesterday that it's nice to be back. Amazing how fast my grandmother had an
expression, and those who work with me know that I quote my grandmother all the
time, she used to say time and tide waits for no man.
It seems
like it was just yesterday we paraded out. We were all excited to be heading
back to the district for Christmas events, and I'm sure most of us have had a
busy January and February, and here we are. Like my former colleague used to
say, in the people's House, doing the people's work. That's a tremendous
privilege, Mr. Speaker, and one that I take very, very serious, and I know most
of us here in the House do that; forty people in the House of Assembly doing the
work of the people of our province.
I did
smile yesterday when my former colleague across the way made a comment that
somebody said to him, you're back to work on Monday. It's true that sometimes
people have that view, that the few weeks we sit in the spring and in the fall
is when we're working. When the truth is it's a very, very demanding job, Mr.
Speaker. And sometimes managing people's expectations can be the most
challenging part of our job, perhaps, especially when you're trying to navigate
your way through some very tumultuous times, financially.
I'm
delighted and I've said it before, I have only been around the Chamber and
working for the good people of Cartwright L'Anse au Clair since 2013 but still
more senior than lots here. So I've been around long enough to remember some
bills in the past that maybe covered things up, that sanctioned things where
openness and transparency was not the order of the day.
So I'm
delighted. I take it very, very serious the work that we do and that my team do
on behalf of the people of the province. And I want to send accolades to the
minister, to my colleague, for bringing in this bill today, Bill 65, An Act to
Amend the Financial Administration Act.
Mr.
Speaker, I sat here this afternoon and I looked at a lot of us who put our name
forward on a ballot, you want to represent your area. You want to do the best
job you can. You can't change the world, but you want to make a difference in
your little corner of the world. And then you form government, Mr. Speaker, and
as was quoted here many times, you form government to find out that we're in
rough shape. We have had a rough year. There are Members of my team that have
took, some of them, a tremendous beating, much, much more harder than I have. So
it's very, very important that it is the taxpayer money, as my colleague said.
It's very important that we be open and that we be transparent with the people's
purse.
Another
thing I thought about, Mr. Speaker, is the tabling of Public Accounts that, in
all of the departments, I believe it will make all of my colleagues say; How do
we best invest this money? How do we do things like multi-year funding? And
there are some other wonderful bills that are coming, Mr. Speaker, that was
outlined in The Way Forward document.
How do we best invest this money to provide stability, to get a better bang for
the buck? I think about multi-year funding, I think about contract work in
Labrador, the area where I reside, and the short seasons that we have and all of
the benefits that's going to come.
I think
that all ties into this Public Accounts in the interest of openness and
transparency, Mr. Speaker. When we look at our own household if we were blindly
going, trying to do a budget, you can't do it. Pardon the personal reference to
the Minister of Finance, but it's no secret in this province she's been very,
very successful in business. She didn't become successful in business by paying
out huge amounts in interest every month, Mr. Speaker, I would venture to say.
We heard today in Question Period about $900 million in interest being paid,
more than the entire Department of Education.
The
Member for Mount Pearl North can smile away and it's all fun and games. It's not
fun and games when you're talking about the people's money, the taxpayers'
dollars, I say, Mr. Speaker. We have to take our jobs very, very seriously in
what we're doing here.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
Order, please!
I remind
the hon. Member not to be calling Members by their first name.
The
Chair recognizes the hon. the Member for Cartwright L'Anse au Clair.
AN HON. MEMBER:
She better be careful.
MS. DEMPSTER:
Mr. Speaker, I will not stand
in this House and be threatened by a Member opposite and told I better be
careful. I stand here as a Member representing the people of Cartwright L'Anse
au Clair and the people of Newfoundland and Labrador, and I'm certainly
outlining the importance of being open and transparent in government with the
people's purse and the people's money.
And yes,
Mr. Speaker, it's sad. I represent a rural district, lots of challenges. It's
sad when you see schools struggling with limited resources and to see so much
going out the door. But it's moves today like Bill 65, An Act to Amend the
Financial Administration Act that's going to help get us on the right track in
the interest of openness and transparency.
Somebody
talked about the public posturing that's going on here today because we're
looking back to how this wasn't done in the past. I don't know if it's political
posturing, Mr. Speaker, but it is important to explain to people why we're doing
this and it is important for people to understand why we're in the financial
situation that we're in, why you have to say no to many things that you would
like to say yes to.
I am the
mother of a young adult so if she comes to me and she's looking for something, a
request, and I say no, it's important to me to explain why I have to say no.
Maybe some decisions were made in the past and maybe it's going to take a little
while before we can actually say yes to that financial decision. That's called
good management, Mr. Speaker, and it's something that we haven't been that
familiar with in this House of Assembly over the last number of years,
unfortunately.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MS. DEMPSTER:
But it is refreshing to see a
bill tabled today in the House, Mr. Speaker, that all three parties, all three
parties stood and said this is a good thing. We work for the people of
Newfoundland and Labrador and we're navigating our way through some difficult
times. This is a bill in the right direction in the terms of openness and
transparency and putting your money where your mouth is. And it's going to mean,
at the end of the day, that more sound decisions are made for the people of the
province.
I'm
happy to speak to it and happy to support it.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Transportation and Works.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. HAWKINS:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
It
certainly is a pleasure for me today to stand and support Bill 65. I'd just like
to make a few comments with regard to the bill. First of all, I just cannot
believe that all these years have gone by that we've not had these measures in
place, and I would certainly take this opportunity to say how pleased I am and
proud I am of our Minister of Finance for being able to put forward this bill
today and certainly recognize the tremendous amount of work that she had done
and the tremendous challenges that she's facing in having to deal with the
fiscal situation that we are in as a province.
I think
for many of us on this side of the House, when we recognize the fiscal situation
that we were facing, many of us sort of really had to take a second somber
thought, really, of what the heck are we into. Mr. Speaker, I say that in all
humility because, for the most part, I'm a fairly humble person, I think
thanks; I appreciate that snicker over there, but I am.
What I
do, I take seriously. I guess one of the most frightening situations that I
faced was last December 14 when, in fact, we were given the privilege by the
Premier to sit in his Cabinet. I remember very, very clearly the first meeting
when we looked at the fiscal situation that the province was facing. I don't
think ever in my life, Mr. Speaker, that I have a feeling of I want to walk away
from something. But I have to be brutally honest today. The challenges that we
were facing, I tell you, it was certainly, for me, an eye opener. I had to look
at it from the perspective that I think we need to do things better.
Mr.
Speaker, as a result of that, of course, it requires a tremendous amount of
work. I think in this past year the evidence is showing that we have had to do a
lot of soul searching and we've had to do a lot of work in trying to get our
province back into the fiscal situation where we feel that we do have a future
for our young people, for the people that are living in the province.
In my
limited time in business, putting together a budget for the shareholders of the
company and putting together a fiscal forecast every year was a budget is
intended to be just that. It's a budget, how you want to project your spending
and how you want to project your expenses for the year.
Mr.
Speaker, quite frankly, I just could not believe that you could put together a
budget in March, by the end of March and project a $1.1 billion deficit, and
before December of that same year, you're looking at a $2.2 billion deficit.
Now, if you were in business and I know government is a little different than
business in the sense that we do have some social obligations that we have to
make. We know there are programs out there that are run differently, but if you
were in business and made that type of error, I don't think you'd have a
business very long.
So, Mr.
Speaker, I think it's important for all of us to learn a lesson from that. I
really want to applaud the minister for saying and saying that going forward
to be open, to be transparent, it is important for us as a province to make sure
the people of the province are well aware of the financial situation or the
financial conditions in which we're facing.
Mr.
Speaker, Bill 65 will give us the ability to make sure the Public Accounts, to
make sure that people are aware of the situations we're facing. My
understanding, Mr. Speaker, as well, is that all three parties, prior to an
election, all three parties put together a platform. When you put together your
political platform, you put together your platform based on information you have
based on the most accurate information you have at that time.
I think,
Mr. Speaker, all three parties when they put together their platform, whether it
was a Blue Book or a Red Book or an Orange Book or whatever colour of book it
is, when they put together their political forecast when they were to take
office, based their platform on a $1.1 billion deficit.
Having
said that, Mr. Speaker, obviously the government that was going out at the time
should have known their finances at the time, and probably should have put
together their platform based on a $2.2 billion deficit, not on a $1.1 billion.
But us, at that time, as an Opposition and looking to form government, part of
putting together the Red Book, of course, was very important for us, and a lot
of what the forecasting was based on, the deficit and the numbers that we knew.
As we
all know, and the Premier has been very, very clear in this House in asking and
has been very, very clear in saying that he requested from the administration at
the time, the previous administration, to give us an accurate account of exactly
where we are financially.
I know
the Opposition sometimes is quick to say, well, you know, you have to be blind
if you didn't think the finances were worse than what they were because of the
plummeting oil prices. Yes, that's true; however, it would have been very easy,
knowing those prices were plummeting, there should have been at least if they
were governing at the time, obviously, there should have been some financial
forecast that would have been built into that and expenses that were there, and
should have been able to give us a better idea, and the people of Newfoundland
and Labrador at the time, a better idea of exactly where we were financially.
Mr.
Speaker, that wasn't done. Unfortunately, it wasn't done. It created, for any
new government taking over, it created significant challenges. These are the
challenges, Mr. Speaker, we have been dealing with as a government, and it
certainly has created, I guess from where we're sitting as a government,
decisions that we've had to make that are less than desirable. Obviously, we are
trying to put this province back into a fiscal situation whereby and I've
often said it, I said it last year in the budget, whereby my grandchildren are
able to live within this province and not have the burden of a debt that is
increasing to an amount that is not sustainable.
I say,
Mr. Speaker, the debt is certainly not sustainable. I think the hon. Minister of
Education and Early Childhood Development today, very eloquently stated that the
number two largest debt, or largest expense item going forward right now is
interest that we're paying on our debt.
As a
matter of fact, the interest we're paying on our debt exceeds the amount of
money we were able to spend on education. Just imagine, Mr. Speaker. If we had
been prudent in our spending over the last number of years, if we were able to
have a good, solid fiscal framework in place over the last number of years and
we were able to reduce that interest by even half, that's another $400
million-plus, Mr. Speaker, we would have been able to put into some of the
programs that we have in this province that people readily want; but, of course,
Mr. Speaker, that's looking back. We all know what happens; you can't keep
building your future on looking back.
So it's
important for us now as a government to put in place measures whereby, when we
are able to forecast going forward, and this year and last year we put together
a budget, we put together a forecast for this fiscal year and we have to the
best of our ability, we have stayed our course and we have seen some significant
improvements in areas that we had looked at in making sure that we're able to
have a fiscal balance by the year, I think it's 2022-23.
Mr.
Speaker, I think it's very, very important for us to continue that. And this
particular bill that the minister has put forward will now give us an
opportunity, will give this government an opportunity, will give the people of
the province an opportunity to see exactly what our Public Accounts are saying;
will give us the numbers that's important for us; will let us know and will let
the people of the province know prior to an election and, of course, earlier in
the year.
I think
we've already mentioned one of the big challenges that the minister had to face
because the Public Accounts had not been done by the previous administration,
one of the huge challenges the minister had to face was getting our Public
Accounts together in the early part of last year and that was a challenge. Then,
of course, not only that, then she worked through making sure the Public
Accounts was ready for October of last year. So there was a tremendous amount of
work in getting Public Accounts pulled together, Mr. Speaker, really two Public
Accounts in one calendar year and that certainly was a significant amount of
work.
So as we
move forward, I think this is a very positive move. I certainly applaud the
Members opposite for seeing this as a very positive move, that going forward,
going forward now, Mr. Speaker, we will be in a better position to have our
accounts so that the people are aware of where we are spending and where our
expenses are going and be able to look at and have a better fiscal understanding
of where we are as a province.
So, Mr.
Speaker, in spite of the many challenges we are facing, the many challenges we
have faced over the last year, I am optimistic that as we continue to chart our
course going forward over the next three years, that we will continue to be
fiscally responsible. We will continue to make sure we are providing the
services for the people of our province based on the ability that we have within
our fiscal framework to do so.
I
believe, Mr. Speaker, that as we have worked through this past year and through
the many challenges, and we know people have faced many challenges. I have said,
over a number of occasions, that we have to understand that when we put together
a fiscal framework, our fiscal framework cannot forever and a day be based only
on revenue generation. And that's an area that we're looking at. There has to be
a focus on expenses, because we all know that it's not enough to just grow
revenue and continue to grow expenses. If we continue to do that, Mr. Speaker,
we're never, ever going to get to a point whereby we can find that we have a
solid fiscal framework in place.
And so,
Mr. Speaker, what we have to do, we have to find a balance. We have to find a
balance in that we have a revenue generation, we know what our revenues are
going to be, we have a solid forecasting in our revenues and then we have to
bring our expenses in line and to understand that there are areas that we have
to find efficiencies. And I think that this government has started to look at
that very, very seriously. We're looking at efficiencies within our government,
ways in which we can provide services to the people in the province in a more
efficient manner, and looking at ways in which we can save some of our expenses
in order to be able to balance out our fiscal framework.
So I
think today is a very important first move for us to make sure that we have
measures put in place, and this bill will certainly make sure that the measures
that we put in place will be evident to the people of the province and will be
evident to people that are looking at being able to determine what expenses they
want to incur.
I think,
again, it will be certainly a good measure for future generations and future
people that are going to be interested in politics so that they know in advance
of an election how to build their platform, what political pressures they will
have, and how we will be able to sustain a fiscal framework going forward.
Mr.
Speaker, I certainly want to thank you for the opportunity today to speak on
this bill and, again, I want to just thank the Members opposite for supporting
this because I think it's the right thing to do. I think it will certainly be,
for us, a very positive not only for this government, but for subsequent
governments as well because it will give us an opportunity and give the people
an opportunity to see just exactly where our fiscal situation is.
Mr.
Speaker, thank you for this opportunity.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for
Placentia West Bellevue.
MR. BROWNE:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
It's
great to stand on my feet again. It's always an honour and a privilege to stand
in the House of Assembly and, as other speakers have alluded, it's good to be
back in the House of Assembly. It's been quite an interesting and busy few
months since we last were here. I wish all Members a happy new year it's never
too late to say it and certainly wish everyone all the best as we move forward
through this session.
I can
certainly say that I'm very happy to stand and support the amendments being put
forth today to the Financial
Administration Act. In an effort to improve the timeliness of Public
Accounts, these amendments will require that the Public Accounts be tabled on or
before October 31 of the following fiscal year.
I think,
Mr. Speaker, as many have alluded, that this is an important point to consider
because this is truly how information is given to the people of the province
and, indeed, Members of the Legislature who are representatives of the said
people of the province. Strong fiscal management I would say if you went
through Hansard, you'd have every government of every stripe saying that strong
fiscal management's their priority. But really, it's not in your rhetoric but,
moreover, in the evidence that comes behind your time in government where you
see whether that's in fact a priority for your government.
And it
was just so troubling and still is troubling for so many people to see what
happened in the year that the governments changed and how long it took to get
information on the Public Accounts. We all know, Mr. Speaker, that then
Opposition Leader wrote to the former premier, September 28 of 2015, demanding
the Public Accounts be released they were not. They were subsequently tabled
January 26 of 2016. That's the latest they've been tabled since 1998-99.
Mr.
Speaker, these amendments serve now as a means to legislate a time frame for
those Public Accounts to be put out there, particularly in an election year. So
not only the people running for office, not only political parties know, but the
people of the province know. Because it should always be a priority to share
that kind of information with them, and I would argue that when you know that
information is going out there, it will make you more responsible as a decision
maker for the funds that you're expending and the money you're putting out
there. I think, in many respects, it's a way to make the entire system more
accountable, and I think accountability is very important.
Now, so
many people have mentioned what went on in the 2015 year, and rightfully so. I
mean, I can remember I have an email here on my BlackBerry today from a
constituent reminding me that you knocked on my door and here's the conversation
we had, and I remember it quite vividly, Mr. Speaker. I can remember shaking
people's hands under the assumption that the deficit was at $1.1 billion, only
to find out that when the Finance Minister tabled her budget last year that
number really would have been $2.7 billion, had nothing been done. So, really,
these amendments are a cure to that kind of things happening again.
I would
say, Mr. Speaker, it's really not a means to blame any past governments but,
moreover, it's a way to look to our history and learn from it. I once read a
quote: If we do not learn from our history, we're condemned to repeat it. So,
Mr. Speaker, I really think that we need to honestly look back on our past,
learn where we can, accept where things that happened were good and acknowledge
that and move forward. I think when we do that we will certainly be stronger for
it.
Today I
stand here in support of the amendments to the
Financial Administration Act. I believe this contributes to our
commitment to accountability in terms of the finances of this province. I
believe in everything that we do, we should be sharing information rather than
hiding it. Bill 29 comes to mind, but we shan't go there today, Mr. Speaker, but
I just want to say how supportive I am of this. I hope that all Members support
it. I'm glad to hear of the support from all sides.
Thank
you.
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Government House
Leader.
MR. A. PARSONS:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I'm
happy to stand here also and speak to Bill 65. Any time you get a chance to
speak to any legislation in this House is certainly it's not a right; it's a
privilege. But this particular piece of legislation, I think it's quite
important.
As I
want to do whenever I talk about legislation, I talk about maybe the title, the
size of it and the 'substantiveness'. In terms of this one, the act itself, the
descriptor, An Act to Amend the Financial Administration Act No 2 sounds very
plain. The fact is there have been similar bills in the past, many with
different meanings, but when I look at this bill and, again, in terms of its
size, it's not a bill that is huge. It's an amendment. It takes up just a few
sections.
The
section says that section 60 of the
Financial Administration Act, and I will not I'll be quite honest; it's a
very big piece of legislation. I know my colleague, the Minister of Finance and
President of Treasury Board, is certainly more familiar with it than it, but
it's quite an important piece of legislation.
I think
what's being proposed here today is something that contrary to I know my
colleague, the Member for Signal Hill Quidi Vidi, sort of downplayed it and
said I don't know what the big deal is. I think this is important, and I think
my comments today will sort of shine some light on why I think this. Even though
it comes off as something that may be run of the mill, this actually is a
substantive piece of legislation for very important reasons.
What it
says here is quite simple. It says section 60 will be repealed and the following
substituted: The minister shall lay out the Public Accounts required under
section 59 before the House
or submit them in accordance with subsection (4)
before November 1 in the following fiscal year.
And then
it also allows here, Notwithstanding subsection (1), in a year in which a
general election is to be held in accordance with subsection 3(2) of the
House of Assembly Act, the Public
Accounts shall be laid before the House
no less than 15 days before the date
fixed for the general election.
In
addition to the requirement under subsection (1), in a year in which a general
election is to be held in accordance with the provisions of section 3 of the
House of Assembly Act
an unaudited
report on the financial state of the province shall be laid before the House of
Assembly or submitted in accordance with subsection (4) no less than 15 days
before the date fixed for the general election unless one of the following has
occurred within 3 months of the date fixed for the general election: (a) the
Public Accounts for the previous fiscal year have been laid before the House of
Assembly; (b) the Budget Speech has been delivered; or (c) a report on the
financial state of the province has been laid before the House of Assembly.
Now,
again, when you read that it might not sound that significant, but we had to
take it we had to put it in context here. I mean when we stand here and my
colleague did a good job in her opening comments, and I'm sure when she gets a
chance to sum up and close debate, close second reading on this, she'll talk
about it again. Having been through this House in the budget process, both on
the Opposition side and here on government side, it's an important process.
In fact,
personally I think the Estimates process that we go through in the House is one
of the more fascinating parts that the majority of people in this province don't
know much about. I certainly had no idea what it was about until I got in the
House. The fact that you can sit in this House and ask questions for hours at a
time with the minister and their staff and it's not like the regular Question
Period which, as we all know, may have some theatrics and may not always be the
best conveyance of information, I think Estimates is.
Now,
there have been times when certain ministers and I'm just talking about my own
experiences, nobody else's. I had times when certain ministers were not very
forthcoming and said stick to the line. I had opportunities too, ministers, when
I questioned them, when I was in Opposition, they would answer anything you put
to them.
Again,
not very often I'll do this; I'll compliment the Member for Mount Pearl North.
When I was a Health critic and he was the Minister of Health, he sat there and
answered every question. Now, I didn't like all the answers. He didn't like all
the questions, but he answered them. Again, I think there's something to be said
about giving credit where it is due. He did that, he didn't shy away from it.
Now,
some of his colleagues again, and I will say, I never had a chance to question
the deputy or the Opposition House Leader. I never had a chance to question him,
but some of his colleagues and I'm not going to bring up their names. Some of
them who may be there, who may not be in the House right now, it was terrible.
It was terrible. They did not do it. So that shines a light on the fact that you
were willing to co-operate.
I think
when I do it, and you can ask the Leader of the Opposition who was my critic. I
think last year, in fact you usually have three hours allotted, I think we
actually went over four hours because we answered the questions. We tried our
best. Again, I'm sure I didn't answer them all to the satisfaction of the Member
opposite but we tried. My staff who sat here in this House and we went late.
That's what it's about, because this is our opportunity to question the
financial performance of government. To question the taxpayers' money and how
it's being allocated and how it's being spent. That's what we need.
The
thing about a budget is it's only a plan. It's a plan. It is not the actual
expenditure of the money which you get at the end of the year. And that is why
this bill, the repealing of this act and the implementation of this new section
is so important. This is a chance to provide the updated Public Accounts to the
people of this province and do it in a timely fashion.
Now, I
think it was already stated by my colleague from Lab West, that we've done this
in our first year in government in a very expeditious manner, as it should be.
People need to see this information. Good or bad, they need to have it. They
need to have a proper understanding of where our finances lay because it's not
our money. It's not Opposition's money. It's the people of this province's
money, all of us, every single one of us that lives in this province. It's our
finances.
Why this
is so important, and it's been stated by my colleague who stood up. I think the
deficit at the time of the 2015 budget, and if I get my information wrong I'm
sure the minister will turn and shake her head and correct me, as she should do.
I think it was around, and I might be off a bit, $1.1 billion. That is not a
small figure. That is a huge figure.
Now, if
you want to put it in context, as the person responsible for the administration
of justice in this province, I run the Department of Justice. It's a department
which has roughly 1,600 people, not including the RCMP officers in this
province. It's a huge department. Our budget, give or take, is roughly,
approximately $250 million annually. So that deficit was our budget four times
over. That's huge. That's a big number, a very big number.
Again,
knowing what that is, what that plan was, any person, any government will make
plans according to what that information is. The reason it's so important is
that it wasn't the right number. Now, the Member for Mount Pearl Southlands,
he didn't know what the right number was. The Members opposite in the NDP, they
didn't know what the number was. When we were sitting in Opposition, our caucus,
we didn't know what the number was. And I can tell you who else didn't know what
the real number was, and that was the entire populace of this province. They
didn't know the financial state of this province.
There
was only one group that knew, and that was the government of the day, who now
sit in Opposition, who knew and refused to tell everybody in this province and
not just refused to tell, they kept it secret. They kept it secret. They kept
the financial performance; they kept the expenditure of our taxpayers' dollars
from everybody. And there might be a good reason for that, Mr. Speaker, and the
reason being because the real number wasn't $1.1 billion which in and of itself
is a huge number, it's a deficit, it's not to the plus, it's to the bad, to the
negative. It was double that, it was double that. It was $2.2 billion. You could
run the Department of Justice eight times over. And that's what they hid from
the people of this province.
So yeah,
everybody, everybody was shocked, because everybody had an idea. We all had an
idea of how bad it was. I mean, if you asked Joe Chesterfield, he had an idea of
how bad it was. If you asked the media, they had an idea of how bad it was. If
you asked the Member for Mount Pearl Southlands, he had an idea of how bad it
was.
If you
asked us, we had yeah, we knew. We knew it was bad. I mean there was
$1.1 billion, we thought. We had an idea it was bad, but we didn't know it was
double what they said. And again, I cannot state this strongly enough, Mr.
Speaker, they kept that information secret from everybody. They knew it and
wouldn't put it out there.
You know why they wouldn't put it out there, because they
didn't want the public to know how badly they mismanaged this province's money
over the past decade or more. They had no idea they knew it, and they didn't
want anybody else to know it. They wanted to pull a fast one.
And that's why this bill contrary to what the Member for
Signal Hill Quidi Vidi says when she says not a big deal. Well, to the
contrary, I disagree. I think it is a big deal, because I
tend to think that the people of this province deserve to know what the
financial state of the province is. I think they deserve to know how the money
is being spent. And you know what? Especially in an election year when
politicians and political parties run and make promises, I think that the
parties deserve to know so that they can put out the information. And again, we
couldn't.
Now, one
might say well, you should have asked.
AN HON. MEMBER:
We did.
MR. A. PARSONS:
Hold on. I'm building. You
say, well, you should have asked for it you should have asked for it. But the
thing is our Premier, who was then Leader of the Opposition, did ask for it. He
asked for it in September of 2015. When are you going to provide the updated
Public Accounts, the updated financial state of this province? And it was never
responded to.
So it
wasn't a case of just, oh, we forgot to put it out or we never had time to put
it out. It was we've been asked for it and we are choosing not to put it out.
And what we're proposing here today, which I'm glad to hear that there is
support from all Members of this House, I think, I would hope, is that no matter
who is in power that there should be legislation that ensures that the proper
accounting, that the proper Public Accounts, that the proper finances of this
province are publicly known and have it known on a defined date and certainly
before an election.
Rather
than have what we had just in the last election, which was everybody thinking
yeah, it's bad, it's going to be tough, but knowing that it was double what they
said. Again, we all thought they were poor managers; we just didn't realize they
were that bad managers. We didn't realize it. And again, there's a reason they
have one speaker to this today, and nobody else. One, right they had one
speaker. And the reason is they know that this is good now again, I hear them
talking over there. They're talking in their seats, but I'd like to see them
stand up and put it on the record.
Talk
about it; tell us about it. Why didn't you give us the information? Why didn't
you give your constituents the information? Why didn't you give the people of
the province the information? Now, I hear them laughing over there. It's not a
funny matter when you take that information that belongs to people and you hide
it, when you mislead them.
So what
we have here, I think this is a tremendously, tremendously important piece of
legislation and it's one that when this administration is gone, and the next
administration is in, and the one after that, and the one after that, no matter
who it is, the people of the province will know the proper state of the finances
in this province. They'll know it on a timely basis, because this money belongs
to them.
And
that's what's important here, and that's why I'm glad to speak to this and let
the people know why this is important. I'm proud that my colleague brought it
in; it should have been done before. We've had no choice but to do it; we've got
to fix these things so that we can't have administrations that deceive the
people of the province from knowing what the true financial state is because
it's their money; they deserve to know what's going on.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
If the hon. the Minister of
Finance and President of Treasury Board speaks now, she will close the debate.
The hon.
the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury Board.
MS. C. BENNETT:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I
certainly want to thank Members from both sides of the House for contributing to
the debate this afternoon around the amendments that we want to make to the
Financial Administration Act. Mr.
Speaker, the discussion this afternoon has the Member for Ferryland asked some
questions, which I'll certainly look forward to answering when we get into
Committee, and certainly Members on this side of the House have made references
to the importance of transparency when it comes to Public Accounts.
I have
to tell you, listening to the debate and watching the Members opposite, I find
it stunning that there are Members opposite who truly understand the importance
of Public Accounts, having sat on Cabinet committees, I find it interesting that
during this debate, they've chosen not to speak, particularly when they've had
experience on committees, as part of the Cabinet, as part of government, a part
of administration, that has to make decisions based on the financial information
that they are presented.
I would
be shocked that the Members opposite who sat in committees of Cabinet wouldn't
also believe it is and I'm sure from the Member who spoke earlier, the Members
on the opposite side who spoke are very supportive of this piece of legislation,
but I would have also expected that they would speak about how important it
would have been to them in their roles, that they have access to important
financial information as they were making decisions on behalf of the people of
the province.
Mr.
Speaker, we had a number of Members of the House exercise their privilege today,
to stand in this House and speak to this piece of legislation. And as several
have said, it is a privilege. Many of us in this House I would argue all of us
in this House have asked to be elected by the people in our districts in my
case, the District of Windsor Lake because we wanted to come into this House
and debate the laws that affect how government operates; and also affect how the
programs and services that government provides to the people of the province, is
obligated to provide to the people of the province, actually happen.
Mr.
Speaker, I think that it's important that every single one of us take that role
and that responsibility very seriously. With the situation that we're faced with
now in the provincial Treasury, I don't think there's any opportunity for anyone
in this House to take lightly and I certainly have seen my colleagues on this
side of the House take very seriously the situation that we are facing as a
province, and also the difficult choices that we have to make as a government in
order to provide sustainable services for the people of the province.
The
Member for Labrador West spoke this afternoon and we certainly appreciated his
comment and his support of this bill, and certainly his understanding of the
requirement for Public Accounts to go out in a reasonable way. As I mentioned
earlier, I'll look forward to answering the Member for Ferryland's questions
when we go into Committee. I also want to thank the Member for Stephenville
Port au Port for his always-eloquent commentary in the House and his
enthusiastic participation in every opportunity he has to speak to legislation
in this House.
The
Member for St. John's East Quidi Vidi spoke, albeit briefly, to the bill and I
certainly respect her comments and I anticipate her support for this bill as she
has indicated in this House. I also want to acknowledge the Member for Mount
Pearl Southlands who spoke as well about the piece of legislation, as well as
my colleague for Cartwright L'Anse-au-Clair who spoke quite passionately about
the importance of making sure that the financial information that we have as a
government is released to the people of the province in a timely way.
I've
also had my colleague for Placentia West Bellevue speak, and certainly thank
him; as a young Member of this particular government he is, again, very
enthusiastic about taking on his responsibilities to speak to any and all
legislation he can in this House that is important not only to the people of his
district but also important to the people of the province.
I've had
two of my colleagues who sit in our Cabinet speak, the Minister for
Transportation and Works as well as the Minister for Justice and Public Safety,
and I want to thank them for their time and speaking to the bill and supporting
the bill. As Members of Cabinet committees, these individuals certainly have
experience in the last year and a little bit on the complexity and the attention
to detail that, as ministers, we must provide when we work on behalf of the
people of the province in the privileged role that we have as ministers, a role
that we take very seriously under the leadership of our Premier.
Mr.
Speaker, this particular bill is an important one because, from my perspective
from our perspective in Finance, and I think I would say from our perspective
here as a government, we believe the people of the province should have the
information, the Public Accounts Committee that works as representatives of this
House should have the information, and when audited financial statements are not
available, accountability to government is weakened.
I can't
imagine any situation where a Finance Minister, in any circumstances, would not
want financial information about the province to go out in a timely way. I would
be shocked to find out if that was the case for my former colleagues who've had
the privilege of sitting in the role as minister of Finance, particularly those
that have sat maybe as Members of the Opposition party who have experienced
that. I certainly can't imagine that they would have ever wanted anything but
transparency on Public Accounts.
So with
that said, Mr. Speaker, I'll certainly look forward to the discussion in
Committee, and answering questions that Members may have. Again, I want to thank
the Members of the House for their support. From what I understand, the House
seems to be very supportive of this legislation and I'll look forward to
continuing to provide information as requested as part of the debate.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
Is the House ready for the
question?
The
motion is that Bill 65 be now read a second time.
Is it
the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
MR. SPEAKER:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
CLERK:
A bill, An Act To Amend The
Financial Administration Act No. 2. (Bill 65)
MR. SPEAKER:
This bill has now been read a
second time.
When
shall that the bill be referred to a Committee of the Whole?
MR. A. PARSONS:
Now.
MR. SPEAKER:
Now.
On
motion, a bill, An Act To Amend The Financial Administration Act No. 2, read a
second time, ordered referred to a Committee of the Whole House presently, by
leave. (Bill 65)
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Government House
Leader.
MR. A. PARSONS:
Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded
by the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury Board, that the House
resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole to consider Bill 65.
MR. SPEAKER:
It is moved and seconded that
I do now leave the Chair for the House to resolve itself into a Committee of the
Whole to consider the said bills.
Is it
the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
MR. SPEAKER:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
On
motion, that the House resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole, the Speaker
left the Chair.
Committee of the
Whole
CHAIR (Dempster):
Order please.
We are
now considering Bill 65, An Act To Amend The Financial Administration Act No. 2.
A bill,
An Act To Amend The Financial Administration Act No. 2. (Bill 65)
CLERK:
Clause 1.
CHAIR:
Shall clause 1 carry?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
CHAIR:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
On
motion, clause 1 carried.
CLERK:
Be it enacted by the
Lieutenant Governor and House of Assembly in Legislative Session convened, as
follows.
CHAIR:
Shall the enacting clause
carry?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
CHAIR:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
On
motion, enacting clause carried.
CLERK:
An Act To Amend The Financial
Administration Act No. 2.
CHAIR:
Shall the long title carry?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
CHAIR:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
On
motion, long title carried.
CHAIR:
Shall I report Bill 65
carried without amendment?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
The
Chair recognizes the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury Board.
MS. C. BENNETT:
Thank you, Madam Chair.
Just as
a process question, I understood that the Member for Ferryland had some
questions; I don't believe he's had the opportunity to ask those questions in
Committee. If he wants the answers to those questions, I can certainly provide
them; there were as a couple of questions he had asked around economic
indicators and also around the 15 day before October 31. If he'd like those
answers I can provide them, but didn't know if it was appropriate to make that
comment now, Madam Chair.
CHAIR:
Order, please!
Shall I
report Bill 65 carried without amendment?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye
CHAIR:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
Motion,
that the Committee report having passed the bill without amendment, carried.
CHAIR:
The hon. the Government House
Leader.
MR. A. PARSONS:
I move, Madam Chair, that the
Committee rise and report Bill 65.
CHAIR:
The motion is that the
Committee rise and report Bill 65.
Shall
the motion carry?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
CHAIR:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
On
motion, that the Committee rise, report progress and ask leave to sit again, the
Speaker returned to the Chair.
MR. SPEAKER (Osborne):
The hon. the Deputy
Speaker.
MS. DEMPSTER:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
The
Committee of the Whole have considered the matters to them referred and have
asked that I report Bill 65 carried without amendment.
MR. SPEAKER:
The Chair of the Committee of
the Whole reports that the Committee have considered the matters referred to
them and have directed her to report Bill 65, An Act To Amend The Financial
Administration Act No. 2, carried without amendment.
When
shall the report be received?
MR. A. PARSONS:
Tomorrow.
MR. SPEAKER:
Tomorrow.
When
shall the bill be read a third time?
MR. A. PARSONS:
Tomorrow.
MR. SPEAKER:
Tomorrow.
The hon.
the Government House Leader.
MR. A. PARSONS:
Mr. Speaker, I call from the
Order Paper, Order 4, second reading of Bill 67.
MR. SPEAKER:
Order, please!
The
Clerk advises, in order to read the bill the third time, the report has to be
received now.
MR. A. PARSONS:
I'll receive the report now.
MR. SPEAKER:
The report shall be received
now.
When
shall the bill be read a third time? Tomorrow?
The bill
shall be read a third time tomorrow.
MR. A. PARSONS:
Tomorrow.
MR. SPEAKER:
Tomorrow.
On
motion, report received and adopted. Bill ordered read a third time on tomorrow.
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Service NL.
MR. TRIMPER:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I move,
seconded by the Member for Labrador West, that Bill 67, An Act To Amend The
Public Safety Act, be read a second time.
MR. SPEAKER:
It is moved and seconded that
Bill 67 be now read a second time.
Motion,
second reading of a bill, An Act To Amend The Public Safety Act. (Bill 67)
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Service NL.
MR. TRIMPER:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I'm very
pleased to rise in this hon. House today to speak to Bill 67. It is an amendment
to the Public Safety Act. With this
bill, we will be amending subsection 29(4) of the
Public Safety Act to decommission the
Boiler Pressure Vessel Advisory Board, an inactive entity which is no longer
needed by this government.
In
The Way Forward, our government
identified 218 agencies, boards and commissions in Newfoundland and Labrador.
We've set the goal of reducing these total ABCs by 20 per cent by the year 2020.
The bill we are bringing forward today is one example of how our government is
moving forward toward meeting this goal.
In 1981,
the Boiler Pressure Vessel Advisory Board was created under section 28 of the
Boiler Pressure Vessel and Compressed Gas
Act. At the time, the provincial economy was evolving and industrial
development was happening at a rapid pace. Within this context, there was need
for training, certification for professionals working on boilers and pressure
vessels throughout this province and, of course, a need for oversight of this
industry.
In 1996,
the Boiler Pressure Vessel and Compressed
Gas Act was repealed, and in 1997 it was replaced with what we know today as
the Public Safety Act much easier to
say, by the way. The board was last appointed in 1993 for a two-year term and
has not been active since. By the mid-1990s, the previous responsibilities of
the Boiler Pressure Vessel Advisory Board had shifted to different entities.
Today,
the Department of Advanced Education, Skills and Labour is responsible for
overseeing the qualifications of the power engineers who work on boiler pressure
vessels. The role of the previous board's examination committee is also now with
that same department. As with other industries, this industry is now regulated
by the skilled staff of my department, Service NL.
The term
pressure vessel can refer to a wide range of products. It includes such things
as propane storage tanks and commercial hot water tanks in hotels. It can refer
to air receivers in garages, and heating boilers in churches and schools. It can
also refer to process equipment such as that at the Come by Chance oil refinery,
which has over 600 pressure vessels alone and power boilers at industrial sites
like the Corner Brook Pulp and Paper Mill and the Iron Ore Company of Canada
mine. Service NL has taken over the responsibility for all inspections,
investigations and enforcement of the professionals who work on these vessels.
Mr.
Speaker, I'd like to give a picture of the breadth of the work that Service NL
does in this regard. Currently, we have 1,288 active boilers and 8,013 active
pressure vessels in this province, for a total of 9,301 active boiler pressure
vessel devices. Boiler pressure vessels are inspected in accordance with our
periodic inspection policy resulting in an average of some 4,000 scheduled
inspections being conducted per year.
All new
boiler pressure vessels are inspected before they go into service and when
repairs or alterations are completed, as are the pressure piping systems
connected to the boiler or pressure vessel. This results in another 500 to 600
demand inspections being conducted each year.
The
boiler pressure vessel technical expert team consists of 14 people, plus
administrative support. This team includes trained staff in boiler and pressure
vessel inspections, pressure vessel engineering and design and pressure welding
inspection. With all these functions now covered by other existing departments
within our government, the Boiler Pressure Vessel Advisory Board has not been
needed for many years. This is why we are moving to decommission it.
Mr.
Speaker, public safety is of paramount importance to our government. Industry in
our province consists of thousands of talented workers who deserve our utmost
care in legislation that relates to their safety and security. However, as
industries evolve, it is important that our legislation evolve with it. We are
confident that the safety and security of the people of Newfoundland and
Labrador are well served by our current system and that decommissioning this
board will have no impact on this goal.
I will
conclude by thanking the dedicated staff of both Service NL and the Department
of Advanced Education, Skills and Labour for their tireless work in regulating
and administrating the duties that previously fell to the Boiler Pressure Vessel
Advisory Board. The dedication of these staff to this and the many other
industries under their purview is an example of better collaboration among
departments.
Thank
you very much.
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for Cape
St. Francis.
MR. K. PARSONS:
Thank you very much, Mr.
Speaker.
I'm just
going to take a couple of minutes to speak about the bill. Basically, first of
all, I'd like to thank the officials over to the department. I went over
yesterday for a briefing on this and I think one person called it (inaudible)
simply a bit of housekeeping is what she said. But it's important to still have
regulations in place because whenever you're dealing with valves or any kind of
pressure at all in the workplace, safety is always something that should be in
the foremost of anything that's done, whether it's on a job site or whether it's
at a facility.
I know
the minister named several facilities that have boilers and pressure valves. We
talked about it the other day, like hockey arenas and different areas like that.
So it's very important that the inspections do get done on these valves and on
the pressure because, again, it's a safety issue for whoever is working in those
facilities.
It was
interesting to me over there the other day, to listen to how many are actually
in the system. You know, when you talk about boilers and pressure valves and
stuff like, you didn't realize it was thousands and thousands. So it's important
that we make sure everything is done correctly. I think the minister also
mentioned that last year through Service NL I believe, Minister there was
over 4,000 inspections done. So it'll tell you that our people, our hard-working
public servants are out there doing their job and making sure that safety is an
important part of any workplace.
Again,
with the Boiler Pressure Vessel Advisory Board, the last time this was an active
board was in 1995, which is over 20 years ago. The last appointment to this
board was done in 1993, and that was for a two-year term. Also, the
Boiler Pressure Vessel and Compressed Gas Act,
like the minister also said, was changed in 1997 to a
Public Safety Act, which is and I
know, Mr. Speaker, over a number of years, and we've all seen it through the
news and everything like this, where sometimes a lot of injuries and also death
has been caused in worksites where it's not safe, and it's important that we do
have a safe workplace.
This
committee was important, but as the years got on and as certification came
through, different departments like Service NL and the power engineers, and
there's a certain certification that's there today that wasn't there back in the
'80s and '90s that people have to abide by. So it's very important. Also, the
number of inspections that are done today, it's good to see that this is done to
make sure our workplace is safe.
We just
look at the equipment today that is being used; I'd say the technology is a
whole lot better than what it was in the past and certification of anything
that's done now, whether it's on a worksite or it could be a, like I mentioned
an arena or anything like that, it has to make a certain certification. So
that's important. And it's important that we have the inspections. But this
advisory board itself that was set up in 1995, its purpose is no longer needed
because of the expertise we have with our power engineers and stuff like that.
So this is a bill that we will support.
Thank
you very much.
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for Fogo
Island Cape Freels.
MR. BRAGG:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I'm
pleased to rise in this hon. House and lend my support to Bill 67, An Act to
Amend the Public Safety Act.
Although, I got to say before I start, I don't want anybody to be frightened by
An Act to Amend the Public Safety Act. It sounds much worse than it is. This is
basically a decommissioning of the Boiler Pressure Vessel Advisory Board, which
was last used in, I think it was 1995.
And as
the hon. Minister of Service NL mentioned, in recent years the skilled staff of
the Department of Advanced Education, Skills and Labour have taken the
responsibility for certification and qualifications of power engineers who work
on boiler pressure vessels in this province.
I was
trained as a power engineer one of my many talents, I think, over the years
and I can tell you what, in this industry, attention to safety is vitally
important. Pressure vessels must be regularly inspected and ensure their
continued viability.
Now,
most people don't have any idea what a pressure vessel is, but I'm going to
bring it down to a level that I think anybody who ever got a shower will
understand what a pressure vessel is. The hot water tank in your house is a
pressure vessel. Now, you don't need a fourth-class power engineer to install or
operate a hot water tank. But if anybody here ever had a leak in their hot water
tank, they'll know on the side of that tank there's a pressure relief value.
That is vitally important to the functioning of the hot water tank.
Should
that value stick, be plugged and the temperature in the tank increase, increase
the pressure created from the tanks, creates some steam in there, which could
happen if their element stayed engaged, the side, the top, the walls would
blow out of that tank.
Now, if
you can imagine, that little tank only stands about 4½ feet high; that's enough
to take a roof off most houses.
AN HON. MEMBER:
I feel unsafe (inaudible).
MR. BRAGG:
They're very unsafe. The next
time you're in the shower, run more hot water than cold. But the thing is, what
we're looking at here, this was an Advisory Board put in place of industry and
government of the day. And as the minister said, we've evolved since that.
So we
are gone into something that's much bigger than a hot water tank. There are
numerous values, pressure release valves. There's steam. There's water pressure,
you name it. So this will be like what building? Maybe this building. The
Health Sciences Centre comes to mind. You will see the big, old stack outside
where the heat is coming up. Underneath that somewhere in the workings of that
is where you are going to find your power engineers. There's going to be
different classes of power engineers.
The
basic first level will be a fourth-class power engineer, and that's what I
trained to be. Now, that basically takes you a step above the hot water tank,
but it does not bring you up to the kilowatt for a third class. So you have the
third class, which would be the next level, a second class, and most times
someone mentioned Come By Chance. You would need to be a first-class power
engineer to run an operation like Come By Chance because when the kilowatt hours
get so big, then you're into something, more pressure, more design, more issues.
So we
got that away from the Advisory Board. It came to, again, the lovely minister
over there of the Department of Advanced Education, Skills and Labour. His
people ensure the certification. If you walk into any plant, any plant, fish
plants, you go into the engineering room, the plant room they'll always call
it the plant room you're going to see the plant registration on the wall.
That's going to tell you the horsepower of the operating engineers that are
there and the requirements, so that's all registered with the government, we've
got that, and also the certification of every engineer in that building is
posted on that wall. So you know that's being operated by the right people who
can do the job. So that is all being governed actually, by again, our good
minister over there of the Department of Advanced Education, Skills and Labour.
Now that
we've evolved from that
AN HON. MEMBER:
Do Holyrood work like that?
MR. BRAGG:
Holyrood definitely works
like that. Again, in those bigger plants, you're going to see a higher class
power engineer. And it works opposite. You would think higher would be numbers
going up, but it actually goes from four down to one.
So the
staff of this department does important work, Mr. Speaker. And it's because of
their professionalism that we're able today to decommission the Boiler Pressure
Vessel Advisory Board with no impact whatsoever on public safety. I commend them
for the work they do.
I thank
you very much, Mr. Speaker, for having a chance to speak on this today.
Thank
you.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for St.
John's East Quidi Vidi.
MS. MICHAEL:
Thank you very much, Mr.
Speaker.
I think
I should add my voice to say yes, I will be voting for this bill. I think that
we don't have to overplay what we're doing here. What it is, is repealing
something that hasn't existed, except on paper, for a couple of decades. And in
case people in the province who may be listening to us this afternoon have any
fears, as has been pointed out and I'll repeat, the role of this board is really
defunct, the actual role, because expertise that is needed by the government is
available both at the College of the North Atlantic and within the Department of
Advanced Education, Skills and Labour.
So the
board is not needed. According to the
Financial Administration Act, advisory boards may be put in place. This
advisory board was put in place. It's no longer needed, and it has nothing to do
with our making anything unsafe in the province because the expertise is there
and is being used.
So
having said all that, I will not take up any more time and say, of course, I'll
be voting for the bill.
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Hear, hear!
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for Burin
Grand Bank.
MS. HALEY:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I am
pleased to rise in this hon. House to also lend my support to Bill 67. As my
colleagues, the hon. Minister of Service NL and the hon. Member for Fogo Island
Cape Freels, have stated previously, the ongoing maintenance of pressure
vessels is an important issue of public safety, Mr. Speaker. Since the Boiler
Pressure Vessel Advisory Board was first created, the responsibility for
regulation, inspection and investigation has, over time, become part of the day-
to-day activities for Service NL.
As my
esteemed colleague just mentioned, safety inspections of pressure vessels must
be ongoing, thorough and accurate to ensure public safety. Today, Service NL has
a robust inspection and certification system, Mr. Speaker, with technically
trained staff and professional engineers who do approximately 4,000 inspections
each and every year. The list of pressure vessels that my colleague, the hon.
Minister of Service NL, read out earlier shows just how varied and technical
this work can be. And I believe that we, as Newfoundlanders and Labradorians,
owe these technical inspectors our thanks and respect.
I feel
confident in decommissioning this board today, Mr. Speaker, because of the
dedication I see from the staff of Service NL daily. The work they do is
important, and for that I thank them.
Thank
you so much, Mr. Speaker.
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Member for Mount
Pearl Southlands.
MR. LANE:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I'm just
going to take a couple of moments to speak to Bill 67, An Act to Amend the
Public Safety Act. I'll be supporting this bill. I guess to a great degree,
really, it's a piece of housekeeping, but it's important legislation,
nonetheless, that govern pressure vessels. And, of course, we know that there
are many, as has been outlined by the minister I forget the numbers he said,
but there are thousands of them in the province, and they could range in various
sizes.
One of
the factors around it is not just the size of the pressure vessel, but it's
what's contained within the pressure vessel. And that could be any number of
chemicals or compressed gases. There are many hazards associated to pressure
vessels, in terms of the way they're handled, in terms of the way they are
transported, in terms of the way they are used on the work sites, in terms of
inspections and certifications that are required, in terms of who's qualified to
use the products contained within a number of these pressure vessels.
In a lot
of cases, we have situations where pressure vessels have to be cleaned and we
have confined space entry procedures and so on that would apply, and training
and so on associated to that, and rescue procedures. So when we talk about
pressure vessels in the province, as I said, it is very common in many
workplaces. It is something that needs to be we need to ensure we have
appropriate legislation in place as it relates to transportation, as it relates
to health and safety working with it, as it relates to public safety. Obviously,
the inspection of those pressure vessels is very important as it relates to
that.
So as I
understand it, we do have the expertise in place through the Department of
Advanced Education, Skills and Labour and so on. Basically, the advisory
committee that was put in place back in the early '90s, I guess they've become
redundant. They haven't met, and we already have other mechanisms in place to
ensure pressure vessels are properly inspected in a timely manner to ensure
workplace safety and to ensure public safety.
So with
that said, really what we're doing is we're reducing some red tape. We're
cleaning up, I guess, some of the legislation that's redundant, removing this
committee which hasn't functioned now for some 20-odd years, I believe. So it
only makes good sense; therefore, I will be supporting the legislation.
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Service NL.
MR. TRIMPER:
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I guess
with the conclusion of the commentary from my colleagues in the House, I'd like
to just draw an appreciation, first of all, to them.
First of
all, I'd like to acknowledge the Member for Cape St. Francis; he did attend
their technical briefing. I appreciated that, as did two of my colleagues from
Burin Grand Bank and Fogo Island Cape Freels. I also appreciated his
comments that he indicated this isn't just housekeeping. It is and it isn't. I
think it's really important to underline the hazards and the dangers around as
my colleague from Fogo Island Cape Freels had indicated, who's got the
expertise and the knowledge and experience with this, which is one of the
reasons why I asked him to speak.
These
are extremely hazardous devices that we need in society that we need around us.
This is in no way a compromise to the safety around them, their inspection and
so on. I felt all the Members spoke to that, and I appreciate that very much;
certainly, no impact on their operation, no impact on the safety to the
employees who work around these devices; and also, by the way, no cost to
government. This is very much an opportunity to address something that's been
sitting there for some 22 years. So, very pleased to do that.
So with
that, I'll conclude my remarks.
Thank
you.
MR. SPEAKER:
Is the House ready for the
question?
The hon.
the Minister of Service NL.
MR. TRIMPER:
Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded
by the Member for Labrador West, that the House now resolve itself into a
Committee of the Whole to consider Bill 67.
MR. SPEAKER:
Is the House ready for the
question?
The
motion is that Bill 67 be now read a second time.
Is it
the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
MR. SPEAKER:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
CLERK:
A bill, An Act To Amend The
Public Safety Act. (Bill 67)
MR. SPEAKER:
Bill 67 has now been read a
second time. When shall the said bill be referred to a Committee of the Whole
House?
MR. A. PARSONS:
Now.
MR. SPEAKER:
Now.
On
motion, a bill, An Act To Amend The Public Safety Act, read a second time,
ordered referred to a Committee of the Whole House presently, by leave. (Bill
67)
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Minister of
Service NL.
MR. TRIMPER:
This may sound like an echo,
Mr. Speaker, but I do move, seconded by the Member for Labrador West, that the
House now resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole to consider Bill 67.
Thank
you.
MR. SPEAKER:
It has been moved and
seconded that the House resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole to review
Bill 67.
Is it
the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
MR. SPEAKER:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
On
motion, that the House resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole, Mr. Speaker
left the chair.
Committee of the
Whole
CHAIR (Dempster):
Order please.
We are
now considering Bill 67, An Act To Amend The Public Safety Act.
A bill,
An Act To Amend The Public Safety Act. (Bill 67)
CLERK:
Clause 1.
CHAIR:
Shall clause 1 carry?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
CHAIR:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
On
motion, clause 1 carried.
CLERK:
Be it enacted by the
Lieutenant Governor and House of Assembly in Legislative Session convened, as
follows.
CHAIR:
Shall the enacting clause
carry?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
CHAIR:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
On
motion, enacting clause carried.
CLERK:
An Act To Amend The Public
Safety Act.
CHAIR:
Shall the title carry?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
CHAIR:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
On
motion, title carried.
CHAIR:
Shall I report Bill 67
carried without amendment?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
CHAIR:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
Motion,
that the Committee report having passed the bill without amendment, carried.
CHAIR:
The hon. the Government House
Leader.
MR. A. PARSONS:
Yes, Madam Chair, I move that
the Committee rise and report Bill 67.
CHAIR:
The motion is that I do rise
and report Bill 67 carried without amendment.
Shall
the motion carry?
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
CHAIR:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
On
motion, that the Committee rise, report progress and ask leave to sit again, Mr.
Speaker returned to the Chair.
MR. SPEAKER (Osborne):
The hon. the Deputy
Speaker.
MS. DEMPSTER:
Mr. Speaker, the Committee of
the Whole have considered the matters to them referred and have asked that I
report Bill 67 carried without amendment.
MR. SPEAKER:
The Chair of the Committee of
the Whole reports that the Committee have considered the matters to them
referred and have directed her to report Bill 67 carried without amendment.
When
shall the report be received?
MR. A. PARSONS:
Now.
MR. SPEAKER:
Now.
When
shall the said bill be read a third time?
MR. A. PARSONS:
Tomorrow.
MR. SPEAKER:
Tomorrow.
On
motion, report received and adopted. Bill ordered read a third time on tomorrow.
MR. SPEAKER:
The hon. the Government House
Leader.
MR. A. PARSONS:
Yes, Mr. Speaker.
Given
the hour of the day, I move, seconded by the Member for Burin Grand Bank, that
the House do now adjourn.
MR. SPEAKER:
The motion is that the House
do now adjourn.
All
those in favour, 'aye.'
SOME HON. MEMBERS:
Aye.
MR. SPEAKER:
All those against, 'nay.'
Carried.
On
motion, the House at its rising adjourned until tomorrow, Wednesday, at 10 a.m.