December 7, 2005 HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY PROCEEDINGS Vol. XLV No. 43


The House met at 2:00 p.m.

MR. SPEAKER (Hodder): Order, please!

Admit strangers.

MR. E. BYRNE: On a point or order, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair recognizes the hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, as you know, I visited your office this morning to lodge a complaint and to inform you that I would be standing on a point of order today.

Yesterday after Question Period, some members of the caucus came to me alleging comments that were made directly after Question Period in response to questions by the Minister of Education made by the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans, and I will get to that in a moment. But I do want to say up-front, Mr. Speaker, that unparliamentary language, personal attacks on members are unwarranted, unjustified and, frankly, not allowed.

I want to reference for you page 522, Marleau and Montpetit, where it says, "Remarks directed specifically at another Member which question that Member's integrity, honesty or character are not in order. A Member will be requested to withdraw offensive remarks, allegations, or accusations of impropriety directed towards another Member."

On page 525 of Marleau and Montpetit, Mr. Speaker, it says under heading of Unparliamentary Language: Thus, the use of offensive, provocative or threatening language or words are not in order, a direct charge or accusation against a Member is not in order.

Mr. Speaker, in the last three years - I will even go back, ever since the current Premier became Leader of the Party, Leader of the Opposition, members opposite have consistently and continuously directed personal assaults at the member. For example, I recall during one debate where members of the then government, now members of the Opposition, were made to stand and apologize for calling the Premier a racist.

Last week, the Member for Torngat Mountains stood and basically said that the Premier discriminates against children in Labrador as opposed to people or children on the Island portion of our Province. Another direct allegation. It has been said of him and direct charges in the House, for example, that he does not care about children, that he has no use for seniors.

Now, yesterday, Mr. Speaker, the Minister Responsible for the Status of Women and the member who is the critic opposite, all members stood in this House, took a moment of silence to recognize what has commonly been referred to as the Montreal massacre. Yesterday, in this House, on that very day - and I gave you a tape this morning, Mr. Speaker, which clearly indicates and shows for all members to hear, that when the Minister of Education sat down, when she referenced in answers to questions to the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans where she talked about more gender equity on the Board of the College of the North Atlantic, the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans sits in her chair, shouts out across the House, the Premier hates women. If you look at the -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. E. BYRNE: Mr. Speaker, if you look at the tape, which I believe you have, as I have, it is clear and unequivocal that the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans, in the tradition of that party and that caucus of making these types of accusations against the Premier, once again made that accusation.

Mr. Speaker, I can speak for this caucus today on this issue, that all of us took personal offence to that when we saw that. Members, men and women in this House, on this side, took offence and I would say to members opposite, that they should take offence, too. I am sure, although I have not spoken to the Premier's family, I am sure that his wife, his daughters, his son and his entire family take offence to it, Mr. Speaker, and the member should be stood and asked to withdraw and apologize unequivocally to the Premier of the Province for such an inflammatory accusation that has no basis in merit whatsoever.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The Chair acknowledges that the Government House Leader visited my office earlier today. The Chair also acknowledges that yesterday, while I was speaking to the House in the routine business, the Chair heard part of a comment and was not quite sure of what was said. However, a few moments ago, about half an hour ago, I did visit the broadcast centre and it is quite clear that the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans can be seen on the video and heard on the tape to say the words that the Government House Leader has mentioned.

We know that in all parliamentary institutions there is a code that we try to live by, and that is that we try to avoid offensive, provocative and threatening language; a language which takes away the integrity of any honourable member.

On that basis, I ask the hon. Member for Grand Falls-Buchans to stand and to unequivocally withdraw her comment.

MS THISTLE: Mr. Speaker, thank you for this moment.

I know there are many reasons I could give, but -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The member had an opportunity, right after the point of order was raised, to comment on the point of order. She waived that right; so, at this moment, the Chair is asking her to unequivocally apologize without any explanation or commentary thereto.

MS THISTLE: Mr. Speaker, I unequivocally apologize for the comments I made yesterday.

Thank you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

This afternoon I am pleased to welcome to the public galleries, Mr. Waylon Williams, the Executive Director of the Combined Councils of Labrador. I do understand that Mr. Williams is visiting the Legislature and the offices here on other business.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

Statements by Members

MR. SPEAKER: We have members' statements as follows: the hon. the Member for the District of Grand Bank; the hon. the Member for the District of Burin-Placentia West; the hon. the Member for the District of Port de Grave; the hon. the Member for the District of Lake Melville; and, the hon. the Member for the District of Humber Valley.

The Chair recognizes the Member for Grand Bank District.

MS FOOTE: Mr. Speaker, I rise today to extend sincere congratulations to Bruce Buffett, a member of the Grand Bank Lions Club, who received the Melvin Jones Fellowship Award at the club's fifty-fourth Annual Charter Night on November 25.

Lions International recognizes outstanding individuals like Lion Buffett by bestowing on them the Melvin Jones Fellowship Award. This award is the highest form of recognition and embodies humanitarian ideas consistent with the nature and purpose of Lionism.

Lion Bruce was honored for his commitment to Lionism. He has been a Lion for the past forty-six years, the longest serving member of the Grand Bank Club. He has held most of the offices from the president down and has been a very active member during his forty-six years with the organization.

Among Lion Buffett's accomplishments are: chairperson of the building committee when the Lions Den was built; one of the movers and shakers in raising $20,000 to kick-start the Grand Bank swimming pool; and, he was involved in raising $10,000 to buy the land on which the Blue Crest Seniors Home in Grand Bank is built.

The Grand Bank Lions Club was the first to organize on the Burin Peninsula. This year alone the club, with just twenty-five members, has contributed more than $40,000 at the local, national and international levels.

Mr. Speaker, I ask all Members of the House of Assembly to join me in congratulating Lion Bruce on winning the award and thanking him for his continuing commitment to his community, his district, and Lions International.

Thank you.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Burin-Placentia West.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. JACKMAN: Mr. Speaker, it is with great admiration that I rise today to congratulate a young woman from my district. Ms Karen Paddle of Red Harbour has been awarded a Canadian Millennium Scholarship in the amount of $10,000. This scholarship was awarded to only two individuals from the Province this year, and Ms Paddle's academic achievements and community service won her that honour.

Indeed, Mr. Speaker, it is my honour to know Karen and her parents, Kevin and Gladys. This is a family that has stayed and made a life in rural Newfoundland and Labrador. Karen's success proves that it is possible to be raised in a small rural community and get a top education that will see her achieve whatever she may want in life.

Right now, Ms Paddle is participating in the Canada World Youth Volunteer Program within the country, Russia and Thailand, and will be continuing her studies at Memorial University next September. In fact, Mr. Speaker, I spoke with her father on Monday who told me that Karen had just left for Thailand.

Mr. Speaker, I ask all hon. Members of this House of Assembly to join me in wishing Karen Paddle our sincerest congratulations and best wishes in her future studies.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Port de Grave.

MR. BUTLER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I am pleased to rise today to congratulate Kelsey Morrissey, a thirteen-year-old Shearstown resident, who won the Newfoundland Equestrian Association's Horsemanship Award.

The NEA competition is the biggest in the Province and spans through the summer months. The Horsemanship Award is not won by collecting points. It is an overall view of the rider and horse to see how well they both communicate with each other, and how much control the rider has over the horse. This award is prestigious because it is the only award of its kind available in its division.

Mr. Speaker, Kelsey has been riding horses for nine years, and in this competition she rode her own horse by the name Dawn. Dawn is a Western Canadian quarter horse, born in Saskatchewan. She was purchased in the Maritimes, and has been cared for by Kelsey for the previous four years.

Mr. Speaker, I ask all members of this House to join with me in congratulating Ms Kelsey Morrissey on winning the Newfoundland Equestrian Association's Horsemanship Award.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Lake Melville.

MR. HICKEY: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I rise in this House today to lend my support to those in Labrador who are beginning a lobby to name the recently announced new Canadian Coast Guard Vessel after the late Lawrence O'Brien.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. HICKEY: Mr. Speaker, Lawrence O'Brien was not only a great Member of Parliament for Labrador; he was also a personal friend of mine. Lawrence was a champion for the people of Labrador and their causes, and worked tirelessly on their behalf right up to his death on December 16 of last year.

He was a champion for inclusion of the Trans-Labrador Highway into the National Highway System, which saw a positive outcome this year, Mr. Speaker. Lawrence was well respected in both his political life and private life, making valuable contributions to his beloved Labrador and its residents.

Mr. Speaker, I believe it would be more than fitting to name the new Coast Guard Vessel after Lawrence, a fitting way to keep his memory alive for years to come.

I call upon all Labradorians to support this fine initiative.

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Humber Valley.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS GOUDIE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I rise today to recognize Ms Susan Francis, a resident of Deer Lake, who recently won a national award for the highest score out of approximately 200 individuals in the Province on the Tests of General Education Development, GED, for 2004.

GED testing allows individuals who did not complete high school to earn a high school equivalency certificate, which opens the door to a world of opportunities. This is the nineteenth year that the Department of Education has taken part in the National Awards for Outstanding Achievement Program. Over the past thirty years, in excess of 16,000 Newfoundlanders and Labradorians have successfully completed the GED program.

Ms Francis has proven that determination and hard work pay off. She is a wonderful role model for those who may be just beginning the program or who may be contemplating going back to school to obtain their high school equivalency.

Mr. Speaker, learning is a lifelong journey, and the GED program has provided Ms Francis, along with all the other graduates, with a solid foundation on which to build.

It requires tremendous courage to return to school after a period of absence from the academic world, which makes her academic success an even greater achievement.

I ask all members to join me in congratulating Ms Francis on having received this award. Her determination and hard work are admirable.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: This afternoon we are very pleased to welcome to the Speaker's gallery, Mr. Bill Hogan, a former Member for the District of Placentia. Welcome.

I tell all members who have sat in this House before, they are always welcome in the Speaker's gallery.

It is good to see you visiting us today, Mr. Hogan.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

Statements by Ministers

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I rise today to update my colleagues on our progress in developing a provincial branding strategy to improve government's image and how the Province is projected to the outside world.

This initiative will result in a more streamlined and effective branding of the Province, as we look to promote Newfoundland and Labrador as a preferred place to live and visit, and a productive place to do business.

We are dealing, as you know, with a very competitive global marketplace, and if we are to successful attract new business and investment we must create an identity that sets us apart. This is critical if we are to remain competitive and encourage economic growth.

Mr. Speaker, everyone who lives here or has visited Newfoundland and Labrador knows that we are the best kept secret in the world. We are a vibrant Province filled with an entrepreneurial spirit; rich with natural and human resources; and blessed with a rich and diverse cultural heritage.

Over the past decade or so, the Department of Tourism, Culture and Recreation have succeeded in marketing the Province as a unique and attractive tourism destination. However, the tourism brand was just one of many, many brands throughout government. After completing an audit of all the brands government-wide, we quickly recognized that we as a government needed to re-brand ourselves in order to effectively promote our Province throughout the entire world.

Earlier this year, we commenced a competitive proposal process and I am pleased to announce that Target Marketing and Communications was awarded the contract to shape our vision for a strong and a successful brand. Target Marketing is a local firm with considerable experience and a proven track record in brand development and executing marketing strategies.

Successful branding takes time and specialized skills, and I am pleased to report that work is already progressing on research and analysis of competitors and global positioning, as well as the design and concepts for a brand new signature logo. The goal is to create a brand that will be attractive not only to those from outside the Province, but also one that we identify with as Newfoundlanders and Labradorians.

Mr. Speaker, in order to reach our true potential we must continue to market our Province not only as a great place to visit, but as the best destination to live, and to work and do business.

Identifying opportunities and working to realize those opportunities creates jobs and builds stronger regions and communities. This is a priority for our government and we look forward to unveiling a new visual identity which will guide us as we proceed together along the path to prosperity and a brighter future.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Grand Bank.

MS FOOTE: Mr Speaker, all I can say about this statement is that it reminds me of a statement that was made about Nero during the great fire of Rome: how Nero fiddled while Rome burned.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS FOOTE: Here we are, Mr. Speaker, with a Province in crisis, particularly rural Newfoundland and Labrador. Things are fine on the Avalon, but what does the Premier put out here as a priority? The priority is to improve the government's image. Now give me some leeway here, Premier. I cannot believe that is the priority for your government here, when we have communities like Englee, New Ferolle, Harbour Breton, Fortune, Hawkes Bay all in a crisis out there. We do not know what is going to happen to the Burin Peninsula. We know that FPI is out there now being rumoured to get rid of anything they have on the Burin Peninsula, and this Premier stands up and talks about branding image as a priority for this government. Make no wonder this Province is in a crisis situation under the leadership of this Premier.

Premier, I cannot believe for a minute that you really believe that this is a priority. That you look forward to unveiling a new visual identity which will guide us as we proceed together along the path to prosperity and a brighter future. Tell that to people in rural Newfoundland and Labrador. Tell them about the strategy that you have yet to unveil that you had during the election; how you were going to revitalize rural Newfoundland and Labrador. Your own projections, you have 20,000 more people leaving this Province within the next ten years and you are talking about one of the priorities of government is a new image for the government and branding this Province. Do something for rural Newfoundland and Labrador. Make a difference!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi.

MR. HARRIS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I do not have a problem with the government undertaking a review of our strategy in promoting the Province in a tourism way. Obviously, that has to be done from time to time. I am no marketing guru and neither is the Premier, so it is useful to have people advise the government on that. But, I have a little bit of a problem with the first paragraph, which says that part of the strategy is to improve government's image and with the notion of branding itself. I mean, brand - are we looking at a corporate logo here?

When I look at some of the annual reports that we have, like the one we were given a couple of days ago - the Department of Transportation and Works. When they talk about their vision, they talk about lines of business and every government department, whether it be the Department of Health and Community Services -

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The member's time has expired.

MR. HARRIS: By leave, Mr. Speaker?

AN HON. MEMBER: By leave.

MR. SPEAKER: Leave has been granted.

MR. HARRIS: When they talk about the work that they are doing, they talk about lines of business. What are we running here, Mr. Speaker, a corporation with a logo and a brand? What I want to say is that the business of government is government. While we may have to have a good image for tourism purposes and review it from time to time, but the notion of a brand and a new logo, that somehow or other that is going to make a difference and turn us from a government into a corporation, is a bad thing. We have to look at the obligations that we have to the citizens of Newfoundland and Labrador and make sure that theirs are being undertaken properly. Yes, let's have a new tourism strategy, let's have a new image, but the whole notion of branding, Mr. Speaker, I think is the wrong direction.

MR. SPEAKER: Further statements by ministers?

Oral Questions.

The hon. the Minister of Justice and Attorney General, standing on a point of order.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

Is the Minister of Justice and Attorney General standing on a point of order?

MR. T. MARSHALL: Mr. Speaker, I am standing on a ministerial statement.

MR. SPEAKER: Oh, I am sorry, I had moved to Oral Questions.

Is it agreed we will go back to the ministerial statements?

Statements by ministers.

The hon. the Minister of Justice and Attorney General.

MR. T. MARSHALL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I rise today to honour our veterans for one last time while the House of Assembly is in session during this commemorative Year of the Veteran and the sixtieth anniversary of the end of the Second World War. This year has provided a wonderful opportunity for all Canadians to remember the tremendous contributions of our veterans' achievements and their sacrifices.

Newfoundland and Labrador, in particular, has a proud history of honouring our veterans and this year we upheld that tradition. On May 5, we marked the sixtieth anniversary of Victory in Europe Day with a tree-planting ceremony here on the grounds of the Confederation Building. A handsome red maple now stands as a reminder to all who walk the grounds of the Confederation complex of the women and the men who sacrificed so much to protect our democratic rights.

Year of the Veteran banners have been displayed here in the foyer of the Confederation Building East Block all year. Commemorative portraits of veterans have also been on display, and we have taken part in the annual Fly the Flag of Remembrance ceremony here at the Confederation Building.

Mr. Speaker, in July of this year, I accompanied a group of students and veterans from Newfoundland and Labrador to Beaumont Hamel to commemorate the eighty-ninth anniversary of the Battle of the Somme and to follow the journey of the caribou in France and Belgium and places where the Royal Newfoundland Regiment fought. It was, indeed, an absolute honour and a privilege for me to be able to bring greetings on behalf of the Province and to commemorate the contributions of our veterans, especially the members of the Royal Newfoundland Regiment who fought and died at Beaumont Hamel during the opening day of the Battle of the Somme on July 1, 1916.

Mr. Speaker, to actually be there as a Newfoundlander and Labradorian, to see the trenches, to walk from St. John's trench where they walked down to the danger tree, to read the inscriptions on the memorials, to actually touch the famous danger tree, and to feel that sacred soil beneath one's feet was remarkably overwhelming. It is something I truly hope that every Newfoundland and Labradorian has the opportunity to experience at some point during their lifetime.

Mr. Speaker, I said here before, and as many of you know, that my father, Jack Marshall, was a Veteran of the Second World War. As a young Officer Cadet, he stormed the beaches of Normandy on D-Day and later in his life, as a Commanding Officer of the Royal Newfoundland Regiment, as a Member of the Canadian Parliament and later as a Senator, and later again, as Grand Patron of the Royal Canadian Legion in Ottawa. He was an outspoken advocate for the rights of all veterans.

So, veterans' affairs has always had a special place in my life, and I know that they also have a special place in the hearts and minds of every member in this House of Assembly, and I am pleased we have taken many opportunities to remember and honour our veterans during this commemorative year.

Mr. Speaker, the Year of the Veteran may be coming to a close, but I want to encourage all members of this House and, indeed, all Newfoundlanders and Labradorians to take every opportunity to continue to pay tribute to the men and women who fought to preserve democracy and restore the cause of peace throughout the world. Honour them and cherish them; they are so important to us all.

As the plaque beneath the maple tree on the grounds of the Confederation Building says: May their sacrifices ever be remembered.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Carbonear-Harbour Grace.

MR. SWEENEY: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I thank the minister for an advanced copy of his statement. We, on this side of the House, join with the minister in his words today of commemorating the veteran and the sixtieth anniversary of the end of the Second World War. Newfoundland and Labrador does indeed have a proud history in our involvement in overseas in Europe and elsewhere in this world but, you know, a lot of people seem to keep the veteran and the celebration of what the veteran does for one or two particular days of the year.

I had the fortune of growing up admiring a man who served in the First World War. He was a Member of the Royal Newfoundland Regiment, and he fought overseas. He was my grandfather, George Thorne. His presence with me - for the short time that it was - as a young boy, left me with a great appreciation of what those people went through. Also, to this very day, that same appreciation is brought forward when I hear of other people who are fighting overseas and participating in peacekeeping duties in other parts of the world, and the stress and strain that their families are experiencing.

I think it is very, very important, Minister, that we all take the time and, when we see a veteran, we pay special attention, because the number of veterans from the Second World War and the Korean War are diminishing. It think it is very fitting that all of us, whether we are Members of the House of Assembly or we are private citizens, that we take that time and honour them.

I had the opportunity of going to Beaumont Hamel myself. As you said, walking those trenches, feeling the earth under your feet - in the case when I was there it was mud, because it was pouring rain. Nevertheless, that even brought it more so what those brave men endured that particular day, so much so that upon my return, as minister, I immediately had the pleasure of implementing a veteran's licence plate so that the veterans of this Province now have their own distinct marking for their own personal vehicles.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SWEENEY: Just this Sunday past, I attended the funeral of a very dear friend of mine, Mr. Willert Pynn, who spent six years in the navy in the Second World War. I visited Mr. Pynn on a number of occasions, and next November 11 will be a different experience for me because Willard's birthday was also November 11. When we would leave the Legion in Harbour Grace, after the wreath laying ceremony, we would attend Willard's birthday at his house.

It is a special occasion. I thank the minister for taking this opportunity once again and having that tree planted outside, because there is another planted in Carbonear that was done by five colleagues, five Members of this House of Assembly. The Members for Bellevue, Port de Grave, myself, Trinity-Bay de Verde and Harbour Main-Whitbourne participated in a very lovely ceremony about a month-and-a-half ago.

I encourage all residents and citizens of this Province to continue to keep the tradition of honouring the veteran alive in this Province.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Given the nature of the Ministerial Statement response, the Chair permitted the comments to go on beyond the normal allocation.

We do know that under Standing Order 63.(6), I think it is, we must begin Question Period at 2:30 p.m; however, I ask members if we could permit the Member for Labrador West to respond to the statement that has just been made.

The hon. the Member for Labrador West.

We will not invoke the normal time limits, but I ask you to be mindful of the time we have allocated.

MR. COLLINS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I thank the minister for a copy of his statement as well. We join with the minister and others, Mr. Speaker, in honouring the veterans during this designated Year of the Veteran.

We are glad to hear that the minister went to Beaumont Hamel. I think it is very important for our government, in particular, to take part in the ceremonies in places where many of our residents and ancestors have given the ultimate sacrifice on behalf of all of us. I think, from people I have spoken with, who have been there before - I haven't had the honour or privilege of being there - I understand it to be a very emotional experience as well.

Mr. Speaker, I think it is also time that we, at this time, acknowledge the tremendous efforts of the people in our Forestry Units and the Merchant Marines who had long struggles to get the benefits that they deserve and to get their efforts recognized.

I think it is also important that all of us recognize the efforts that were made by our veterans, because we owe everything that we are to them: the right to sit here in an assembly such as this, the right to practice religion, the right to align ourselves in the form of trade unions. Everything that we appreciate in our society, we owe to our veterans.

I think it was Winston Churchill - and I will conclude with this - who, at one time, said: Never in the history of the world have so many owed so much to so few.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Oral Questions.

Oral Questions

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

My questions are for the Premier.

Mr. Speaker, during the election campaign, the Premier stated that he had the answers to the problems facing the Stephenville mill, and that the mill would not close under his watch. With just two days left to find a solution, no meetings are scheduled. We have asked government to get involved with a mediator for weeks, but the government has refused. Today, the Stephenville Chamber of Commerce have sent a letter to the Premier asking that his government get involved.

I ask the Premier: Are you willing to get personally involved to find a solution to this most serious issue?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, the commitment was made during the provincial election, and the commitment was lived up to. The commitment of the government, in terms of the arrangement put forward, met the objectives of what the company was looking for with respect to the challenges they had securing a reasonable power rate. We did that. It was accepted by the company. They then turned their attention to negotiations with the union.

The Leader of the Opposition said that for weeks you have been asking for a mediator and we haven't gotten involved. Absolutely false, Mr. Speaker. For weeks we have been engaged with the parties, advising them that a mediator will be provided.

We cannot force a mediator upon two parties. The local members, the Minister of Education and the Member for Port au Port West have both been engaged. Those services have been offered. They continue to be offered.

Not only that; let me go a step further. If they cannot find one themselves and they wish us to appoint one, we will. Whether that comes from inside the government or outside, we will pick up the cost of it.

The question by the Leader of the Opposition, and the allegations, are false, Mr. Speaker. We have done what we have had to do.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The minister said the Premier has lived up to his commitments, and I certainly hope that he lives up to the commitment that the mill will not close under his watch.

Mr. Speaker, the Premier made many commitments during the election of 2003, in an attempt to get votes from the people of the Province. One of these promises was to remove political patronage from government.

After being elected, the Premier stated in a province-wide address January 6, 2004, and I quote, "We believe that a strengthened public service will ensure that individuals are being hired on their merits as opposed to who they know in government."

Since that time, we have witnessed political patronage at all levels in this government.

I ask the Premier: Why did you make this commitment if you were not willing to uphold it?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, we find ourselves in the difficult position, and positive position, that 78 per cent of the people in this Province support us. Therefore, I would guess that anybody who supports us, who may get any kind of an appointment or be involved in any activities with this government, by virtue of what the Opposition would like, that all those people would not be qualified to work for government or be involved with the government or to accept any position whatsoever.

We cannot select people from the 22 per cent that are left, that just happen to be Opposition supporters, because that is basically what the polls are saying, that the people of the Province support us. So, we find ourselves in a difficult position.

Having said that, what we do is, we hire people who are eminently qualified to do the job. Whether those people happen to be people who are supporters of the Liberal Party - and there are some of them -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: - or they are supporters of the Conservative Party, or they are supporters of the New Democratic Party, we will hire them if they are qualified for the positions, and that is exactly what we have done in every single instance.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, Joan Cleary, a defeated Tory candidate in the last election, has been hand-picked by the Premier for several positions. She has been appointed by the Premier to look after injured workers' issues and, most recently, been given the president's position at the Bull Arm Corporation site. Ms Cleary has no experience in the international marketing effort required for this position, a position that was usually held by senior civil servants in this government. The position pays approximately $100,000 a year. By her own admission, Ms Cleary has stated that she is gearing up to run for the PC Party in the next general election.

I ask the Premier: What selection process was used to fill this position and was the selection made in an effort to raise Ms Cleary's profile for the next general election?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, the qualification of Ms Cleary that the members on this side appreciate the most is that she is an eminently qualified, passionate, dedicated Newfoundlander and Labrador woman. I have had a chance to observe her, the Leader of the Opposition has, and the Member for Bellevue has had an opportunity to observe her. She is a very, very competent woman. She actually worked at the Bull Arm site.

Now, the Leader of the Opposition saw fit, when she first was announced, to criticize her because she was a nurse.

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: I think it is inappropriate to criticize someone because of their profession, especially if she is a nurse. We have very competent people in our own caucus who happen to be nurses. There were very competent people in your own previous government, the previous Minister of Finance, who was a nurse. So to attempt to disparage her because she was a nurse is completely wrong.

Having said that, she has experience on the Bull Arm site for three years, she has experience as the mayor of her community who basically tore up the mortgage because she negotiated good deals with two senior corporations.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Equally important, and finally important, Mr. Speaker, is that she has a good relationship with the workers on that site and she will make sure that she brings deals to that particular project.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Mr. Speaker, I say to the Premier, I have never met Ms Cleary, and the question I asked is: What selection process was used? Obviously there was none, except for you appointing her.

Mr. Speaker, Mr. Len Simms, a former Leader of the PC Party and close advisor to several Cabinet Ministers, was given the Chief Executive Officer position at Newfoundland and Labrador Housing Corporation without any selection process. Mr. Simms receives a healthy provincial pension and is now receiving a healthy salary from the Housing Corporation.

I ask the Premier: What qualifications, other than being a friend of the PC Party, does Mr. Simms have to represent the interests of individuals who are receiving low income housing from this corporation?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, I don't have to stand in this House and defend the record of Mr. Len Simms to the people of Newfoundland and Labrador, I can tell you right now. The former leader of this party was also a very competent minister who happens to know the workings of government very thoroughly.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: He has a considerable amount of private sector experience and knows exactly what he is dealing with.

I want to point out something for the hon. member opposite, just some of the people who are notable Liberals, who are qualified people, who we have kept in office. For example, the person who is now chairing the federal campaign, Mr. Norm Whalen, he continues to be - and was appointed by a previous government - Chair of Newfoundland and Labrador Film Corporation.

Mr. Roger Jamieson asked me if he could continue on in his appointment at Marble Mountain because he had unfinished business and he was doing a good job. I said: There is no need to ask that, Mr. Jamieson. You are doing a good job. You will stay there in that position.

The current candidate in St. John's for the federal party, Siobhan Coady, a very competent and capable businesswoman remains as Chair of the EDGE Corporation. That is the kind of thing we are doing in our government!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Mr. Speaker, clearly, political patronage and, again, no selection process followed.

Mr. Speaker, Glen Tobin, former PC Cabinet Minister, friend of the Premier, was appointed as the Chair of the Newfoundland and Labrador Liquor Corporation. The Premier consistently and constantly criticized the former chair as being a political appointee.

I ask the Premier: Why did you make this political appointment when you previously stated that the position should be advertised and filled by the most qualified individual?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, the President of the Liquor Corporation, that particular position was advertised and that person happens to be Mr. Steve Winter who is doing an extremely capable job.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: As well, as far as Mr. Glen Tobin goes, Mr. Tobin is also a very capable chairperson. And I go back, they neglect to acknowledge some of the other appointments that we have made: Mr. Bill Rowe, for example, in Ottawa as a parliamentary representative -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: - a former leader of the Liberal Party.

Let's go to the Hydro Corporation, Mr. Bill Kelly from Labrador, who both these members would know, an admirable, admirable gentleman who stood up on the Lower Churchill deal and said no to your government. He remains on that board to this day.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Three positions filled, no selection process, I say to the Premier.

Mr. Speaker, LeeAnn Montgomery was recently appointed as Commissioner of Lobbyists. The position was supposed to be independent and nonpartisan. Only one problem, Mr. Speaker, Ms Montgomery is a neighbour of the Premier and a friend of the Premier and a close advisor to the Premier's Deputy Minister, Mr. Ross Reid. Ms Montgomery also served as Ross Reid's official agent when he was involved in federal politics for the PC Party.

I ask the Premier: Why did you appoint a neighbour and a close friend to the position, an individual who has such close ties to the PC Party?

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: I guess that eliminates Hubert Hutton and Jeff Carnell. They are neighbours of mine. I guess they are never going to get an appointment with this government. Your neighbour was Roger Grimes, I believe, wasn't it? I do not think he is going to be along either when it comes down to it.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, LeeAnm Montgomery happens to be an extremely confident female lawyer; a very capable lawyer who has done tremendous work in her profession. She worked at the Workers' Compensation Board from what I can remember. Is she eliminated just because she happens to know a Tory? Do we eliminate these types of people? What about someone down at the film corporation, like Leo Fury? He is a brother of George Fury and Chuck Fury. Do we just go in and fire him? No, we certainly did not. He remains in his position.

So, you cannot just random hit on people who have been appointed and ignore strong supporters of the Liberal Party that we have kept in place. Now, I understand - the Leader of the Opposition is in a bad mood today because the Member for Port de Grave -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

I ask the ministers in reply to keep your comments to sixty seconds, and I recognize the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Four positions filled by friends, no selection process followed.

Mr. Speaker, Mr. Steve Marshall, the Premier's business partner and lifelong friend, was appointed to the St. John's Port Authority.

I ask the Premier: Besides sailing yachts, what experience does Mr. Marshall have regarding the Port of St. John's?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: There are many people, Mr. Speaker, that over the course of the years have had experience at the Royal Newfoundland Yacht Club and have been commodores of the Royal Newfoundland Yacht Club. Mr. Steve Marshall has been honoured and distinguished to be a commodore of the Royal Newfoundland and Labrador Yacht Club - I think it is actually the Royal Newfoundland. I do not even know if it is called the Royal Newfoundland and Labrador. Mr. Clyde Wells was also a former commodore of the Royal Newfoundland Yacht Club.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

AN HON. MEMBER: And he is not political.

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: He is not political, no. So, Mr. Marshall has a tremendous amount of marine experience. He was very qualified for this particular position. He is a friend of mine. He is a very good friend of mine. He is a tremendous individual. He does a lot of charitable work for a lot of people. He does a lot of ex gratia work for a lot of people. I know the Member for Signal Hill-Quidi Vidi knows him very well; he can attest to his credentials.

I stand by my friendship to Steve Marshall. He has not done wrong to anybody, that I could ever see in my life, I can tell you right now.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Leader of the Opposition.

MR. REID: Mr. Speaker, I find it a bit strange. The Premier fired the Chief Justice yesterday, Mr. Clyde Wells, from the Selection Committee for the Order of Newfoundland and Labrador, and now he has the gall to mention him in talking about Steve Marshall.

Mr. Speaker, five positions filled, no selection process. I can go on for the rest of Question Period, but I will ask one final question. Mr. Robert Lundrigan, the former President of the PC Party, was recently appointed the Chairperson of the Workplace Health and Safety Compensation Commission. I ask the Premier: What experience does Mr. Lundrigan bring to this position that will improve the plight of injured workers in the Province?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Lundrigan is not Chair of that board, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I guess we will find out what position he holds, though, very soon.

Mr. Speaker, Pamela Walsh was the President of the College of the North Atlantic, distinguished and well-respected in the field of post-secondary education. She proved her ability through the introduction of new programs and courses in our college system to prepare our young people for the oil and gas and the mining industry. She also negotiated an international contract in excess of $500 million with the Qatari government on the delivery of education. Yet, her contract was not renewed.

I ask the Premier why her contract was not renewed, and how much it cost the taxpayers of the Province to show Ms Walsh the door.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Education.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS BURKE: Mr. Speaker, we have a White Paper completed on post-secondary education, and it is a time of renewal for our college system and our post-secondary system.

Mr. Speaker, we are at a point time in this whole renewal process where the contract of the president of the college - the contract had expired, and it was the decision of this government that the contract would not be renewed.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair recognizes the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair.

MS JONES: It is the silliest song and dance I ever heard, Mr. Speaker, I will tell you now, no answer to the question whatsoever.

Mr. Speaker, Debbie Fry, once the Clerk of the Executive Council, the highest position to be held in the public service, under the Williams' government she was demoted to Deputy Minister of Health. She received national awards for her work in the public service, she was named to the Canadian Council on Health, and well respected in her profession. Yet, she too was dismissed.

I ask the Premier: Why was she dismissed, and how much did it cost to show Ms Fry the door?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, the one thing I am not going to do is stand here today and disparage the reputation of Ms Fry. I have no intention whatsoever of indicating any of the reasons why she was dismissed.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: I can assure the hon. member, though, that she was paid the normal severance and the normal entitlements that she would be entitled to as any other person in government.

If you need to get the answer to that amount, you might want to ask the Minister of Finance the exact amount.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Grand Bank.

MS FOOTE: Mr. Speaker, Florence Delaney is a woman who gave tirelessly of herself as a public servant -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MS FOOTE: It is not funny. If you think Florence Delaney should be laughed at -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS FOOTE: She was a woman who got fired!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair recognizes the Member for Grand Bank, who was putting a question.

MS FOOTE: Florence Delaney is a woman who gave tirelessly of herself as a public servant. She held numerous positions throughout government, working with governments of all political stripes. I had the pleasure of working with her when she was a deputy minister in the Department of Education. Mr. Speaker, there isn't a political bone in Ms Delaney's body.

Why then, I ask the Premier, did you demote her and, by doing so, force her to resign instead of retiring with dignity after her many years of service to this Province? How much did it cost the taxpayers for you to show Ms Delaney the door?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, there was no demotion involved with Ms Delaney. There was a very attractive deputy minister's position offered to her, which was a lateral transfer.

With respect to how much did it take to offer Ms Delaney, or what her severance package was, I can only reiterate what the Premier said. Whatever the normal entitlements would have been when she chose not to accept another position would have been provided to her.

I would like to remind the hon. member that she was part of a government, in their first week-and-a-half of becoming a government, in advising a Premier who fired in excess of five deputy ministers in the first week. She understands as anyone else would do, Mr. Speaker. She was the Director of Communications for a former Liberal Premier who said: There is the door.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. E. BYRNE: Mr. Speaker, as anybody -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. E. BYRNE: All members understand, Mr. Speaker, -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The question has been asked and the hon. the Government House Leader is giving the answer. I ask him to conclude his comments briefly.

MR. E. BYRNE: Mr. Speaker, the fact of the matter is, the allegation put forward by the member is false and incorrect. Ms Delaney was offered another position, she chose not to accept it, and that kicked in severance options.

With respect to the allegations put forward, the member knows that ministers and deputy ministers and senior executives serve at the prerogative of the Premier, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Grand Bank.

MS FOOTE: This is the government that said it would do things differently, Mr. Speaker. We now know how differently they are performing. Yet another competent woman -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS FOOTE: Yet another competent woman who held a senior position has been dismissed, this time by the Premier's long time business partner and friend, Dean MacDonald, who the Premier appointed as Chair of the Board of Newfoundland and Labrador Hydro. Maureen Green, a lawyer with Newfoundland and Labrador Hydro who was respected in the legal community for her abilities, has not had her contract renewed.

I ask the Premier: Why was Ms Green's contract not renewed, and how much did it cost the taxpayers for you to show Ms Green the door?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member and a former minister knows very well that decision was not made by this government under any circumstances. Under any circumstances! Mr. Ed Martin was hired as the new CEO up there and he did a compete restructuring. He met with all the employees and he announced that there was going to be a restructuring which all the employees bought into. They liked the direction in which Newfoundland and Labrador was going, because it is going to be an energy corporation that we are going to be proud of.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: I have said it before, and I say it again, it is going to be a combination of Norske Hydro and Quebec Hydro. It is going to be a model corporation that is going to employ many Newfoundlanders and Labradorians, create benefits and bring a maximum return back to Newfoundlanders and Labradorians, unlike the previous government.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Labrador West.

MR. COLLINS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

My question is for the Minister of Health and Community Services, and it is related to a topic that the former Leader of the Official Opposition raised on May 19, 2005 in Question Period to the acting Minister of Health, the now Minister of Finance, concerning a study on the concerns raised by Gerry Higgins and others in the Province on the possible relationship between electromagnetic fields and cancer.

The minister answered, at that time, that he had concerns in this area and that they would take a look at it, and if they felt it was necessary to pursue it in any greater detail, he said, we will look at that and our officials, whom we consider experts in this area, will make a recommendation on whether or not we should proceed and do something of an extended nature.

I ask the minister if that indeed has been done, and when we can expect an answer.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. OTTENHEIMER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Yes, I am familiar with the issue. There have been perhaps two or three inquiries over the last several months. In particular, the individual from Central Newfoundland that you have referenced. What I did, in fact, upon receiving that inquiry, I instructed my deputy minister to request information from across the country and, in fact, we specifically wrote both federal Ministries of Health and Natural Resources. Some of the information has been received by us in the Department of Health and Community Services. Thus far, the information that we have received is not conclusive in the sense of any link being drawn up on the issue that is being raised.

What I will say to the hon. member, Mr. Speaker, upon receiving the complete set of information, I will be more than pleased to share it with my colleague opposite so that any further development can be discussed here in the House of Assembly.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Labrador West.

MR. COLLINS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I say to the minister, that there are a large number of studies conducted. Some of them, like the one between childhood leukemia and the personal monitoring of residential exposure to electricity, and this finding related to magnetic field exposures directly measured by personal monitoring support and association with the risk of childhood leukemia. There are also other studies with the Ontario electric utility workers that showed an elevated instance of cancer among exposure to electricity.

I want to ask the minister, when he gets all this material gathered, will he issue some type of an information package to people in the Province because there are - and he will find areas of concern - things that they can do to protect themselves in their own homes against the hazards of electricity?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Health and Community Services.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. OTTENHEIMER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

As I have just indicated, the information that we have received thus far is not conclusive. We are in the process of gathering more information. We expect to receive more as a result of the request that we have made and yes, to answer the question raised by my friend opposite, when we receive the information I will be happy to share it with him and with anyone who may be interested.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The time allocation for the New Democratic Party representatives has passed. The Chair recognizes the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans.

MS THISTLE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Since I just heard the Government House Leader say that it was the prerogative of the Premier to hire and fire deputy ministers, I will direct my question to the Premier.

Ann Marie Hann is another well-known and respected public servant who has received national awards and has been credited with improving the Workplace Health and Safety Compensation Commission since her appointment as CEO in 2000. It was despicable to learn that while her staff were honouring her at a staff party for her being awarded one of the top CEOs in Atlantic Canada, she received a telephone call from this government summoning her to Confederation Building to be dismissed. Ms Hann's credentials cannot be challenged. She is a strong woman who has worked in senior government positions for years, including deputy minister positions.

I ask the Premier: Why was such a competent woman dismissed and how much did it cost the taxpayers for you to show another woman the door?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Education.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS BURKE: Mr. Speaker, this government did not dismiss Ann Marie Hann or advise her that her contract would not be renewed.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS BURKE: As part of her contract, prior to the contract coming to an end, it was incumbent upon the board at the Workplace Health and Safety Compensation Commission to advise Ms Hann if they were going to be renewing her contract or not. It was a decision of the board that they were not going to renew that contract.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans.

MS THISTLE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

As I recall, the chairperson of the board at that time was defeated candidate Joan Cleary.

Mr. Speaker, another question -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS THISTLE: Another top level civil servant, Human Resources Director Janet O'Brien, was ousted by former Cabinet Minister and current Chair of the Newfoundland and Labrador Liquor Corporation, Glen Tobin.

Can the Premier tell the people of this Province the circumstance around the dismissal of this highly, competent individual and what it cost the taxpayers of this Province for you to show another woman the door?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Minister of Finance and President of Treasury Board.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SULLIVAN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Steve Winter, who is President of the Newfoundland and Labrador Liquor Corporation, went through a restructuring to run that efficiently, something that had not been done. Millions of dollars - we were outdated in IT and a whole variety of areas. I was not asked, nor did I speak to them whatsoever, on anything to do with this. I learned about it after the decision was made - is when I found out, probably just as soon as the Member for Grand Falls-Buchans. Absolutely, a decision of restructuring by the president of that corporation. I assume, I did not even ask, the president discussed it with the board or made a decision as president to restructure that. I do not know nor I did not ask, and I am not getting involved in the day-to-day workings of a corporation there. That is there to be run efficiently and do a proper job.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Port de Grave.

MR. BUTLER: Mr. Speaker, it is amazing how the Premier went around this Province and said no more political appointments and we have not seen the end of it yet.

Mr. Speaker, my questions are on a political nature but it is not about kicking people out the door, it is about hiring them and hiding them away in the closets.

Mr. Speaker, recently the Premier's daughter's boyfriend, who worked in a political staff position in the government members' office, was placed into a public service position as Director of Communications with a department. Can the Premier tell the House if his potential future son-in-law went through a job competition or was he simply placed in the position because of his connections?

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Premier.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Mr. Speaker, we saw what they stooped to in the point of order that was made today. I have been accused, obviously, of racism and I have been accused of aspersing children. This is a serious matter for me.

We had an engagement party for this couple Saturday night at my married daughter's house. Now, for this gentleman from Port de Grave, of all people, to raise this issue. This is the man who was subject of the Steele inquiry, and I will tell you what Mr. Justice Steele said about this gentleman. In my view, the result was not to portray an impression of believability concerning the primary business of the allegations by Mr. Noseworthy. I am satisfied that Roland Butler gave Ambrose Stoyles the questions on the substance of the questions to assist him in preparation for interviews.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Now, let me explain the answer, Mr. Speaker. It is very important. So, we were not in the process of giving out answers to people who are going for interviews. This man is hired as a qualified person -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

PREMIER WILLIAMS: Let me finish. I need to finish, Mr. Speaker!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

We have about thirty seconds left in Question Period. I ask the Premier if he could finish his answer in that time.

PREMIER WILLIAMS: This government has hired this bright, capable, qualified, young man in a temporary position, which is a perfectly legal thing to do and which the members opposite know is according to the rules and according to the rules of the Public Service Commission. So, he was hired in a temporary position and he is eminently qualified and that is according to law and according to rules. Shame on you!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The time allocated for Question Period has expired.

MR. BUTLER: A point of order, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: A point of order has been called.

The hon. the Member for Port de Grave.

MR. BUTLER: A point of privilege.

Mr. Speaker, we heard today, when this House started its session, that a member in this House had to stand and withdraw comments that were made. I knew this was coming from the Premier leading up over the last couple of weeks, an issue that happened fifteen years ago, and finally we hit a nerve, to give this Premier the opportunity to stand and make accusations of something that was settled fifteen years ago.

Number one, Mr. Speaker, the competition at that time, there were no positions filled at that time.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. BUTLER: There was an inquiry, yes, but there were no positions filled (inaudible).

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

A point of privilege has been raised.

Members know that I treat points of privilege very seriously. The Member for Port de Grave is making a point of privilege, and I would ask him to continue his presentation.

MR. BUTLER: Mr. Speaker, I am standing on this point of privilege and taking it very seriously.

I say to the Premier, back at that time there were no positions filled. There were competitions, yes, and there was a total inquiry. At the end of the day, the Premier knows full well what the results were.

I ask the Premier to be an hon. member, like our fellow colleague on this side, to stand and do the hon. thing and retract something. I can go back fifteen years, too, and he might be on his feet, but I say it is shameful for the Premier to go that low.

I asked a general question: Was there a competition followed? I received no answer, only insults from something fifteen years ago, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: The Chair will take the matter of the point of privilege under advisement -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: - and come back to the House at a later date with a decision.

MR. E. BYRNE: A point of order, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: A point of order has been raised by the hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: (Inaudible) but everyone else here heard it. The hon. Member for Port de Grave just referred to the Premier as a scumbag.

That is unparliamentary, Mr. Speaker, and I ask him to withdraw it.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Port de Grave.

MR. BUTLER: Mr. Speaker, being an hon. gentleman, I will do the hon. thing and withdraw those remarks.

AN HON. MEMBER: The Premier won't do it, though.

MR. BUTLER: But I guess he won't do it.

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

I ask leave of members, if I could continue quickly down through the other routine business matters. I think we have some documents to be tabled, if that is the agreement?

Presenting Reports by Standing and Select Committees.

Presenting Reports by Standing and Special Committees

MR. SPEAKER: The Chair recognizes the Minister of Health and Community Services.

MR. OTTENHEIMER: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, in accordance with the annual report requirements under the Transparency and Accountability Act -

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair recognizes the Member for Bellevue on a point of order.

MR. BARRETT: Mr. Speaker, a threat from the Premier just across the House said to batten down the hatches - a threat across the floor of this House of Assembly, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MR. BARRETT: Mr. Speaker, this House does not call for this kind of behaviour by the Premier of Newfoundland and Labrador. You ought to do a logo!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Government House Leader.

MR. E. BYRNE: Mr. Speaker, I hardly believe that in this House, in any other Parliament across the country, maybe in the Canadian House of Commons, even in the mother of all Parliaments in Britain, are you going to find that batten down the hatches is unparliamentary.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: Furthermore, Mr. Speaker, for anybody who has lived in a marine environment, with a marine history, it simply means this: When you batten down the hatches you make her airtight, and that is exactly what we intend to do!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Speaking to the point of order, the hon. the Member for Bellevue.

MR. BARRETT: Mr. Speaker, in Parliaments in the Commonwealth it is not as much what is being said as how it is being said. The Premier pointed across this House and threatened the Members of this House of Assembly, Mr. Speaker, and I ask him to withdraw his comment.

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair cannot rule on things that the Chair did not see or did not hear. In this particular matter, however, I will check the video tape and come back to the House with a -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. SPEAKER: No, the Chair has ruled that the Chair will come back at a later date.

Tabling of Documents.

Tabling of Documents

MR. SPEAKER: The Chair recognizes the Minister of Health and Community Services.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. OTTENHEIMER: Than you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to table the following: the Annual Report for the Department of Health and Community Services, the Mental Consultants Committee, the Mental Health Board, and the Nurse Practitioner Advisory Committee.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The Chair would like to table the report of the Speaker as Chair of the Commission of Internal Economy to the House of Assembly respecting matters relating to Mr. Fraser March, the Citizens' Representative.

Notices of Motion.

Answers to Questions for which Notice has been Given.

Petitions.

Orders of the Day.

Orders of the Day

Private Members' Day

MR. SPEAKER: I do believe we are having Private Members' Day today, and the hon. the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair is now going to return to her seat and we can have her presentation.

The hon. the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I rise today to present a motion for debate in the House with all of my hon. colleagues, and the motion, Mr. Speaker, is referring to the development of the Lower Churchill project. I think this has probably been a development that has been discussed in our Province for quite a number of years and by a number of governments over that period of time. I know that, for myself, in the last decade, I have been probably engaged in a debate of interest and information over this particular issue during that period of time.

Well, Mr. Speaker, I guess we are at that stage again: a stage in our political history where we are looking to the major developments in our Province, and how those developments can be achieved, and achieved first and foremost for the benefit of the people of Newfoundland and Labrador.

Mr. Speaker, the Lower Churchill, within itself, is one of the Meccas of development for people in Labrador primarily. We have had an opportunity, I guess, in our past, to be able to be home to some of the largest development projects in Newfoundland and Labrador, and I would like to think that, while some of them could have been improved upon in many ways, I would also like to think that some of them have proven to be successful to some degree to the Province and to the people of Labrador.

Well, Mr. Speaker, as discussions open again with the Lower Churchill development, I guess, as one member in Labrador, I am sure that all my colleagues here from the Labrador region will speak to this motion today and express themselves, their views and their aspirations, and their expectations around a development of this stature.

Mr. Speaker, my motion highlights a number of things, some of them which I will get into shortly, but I think the most important thing that it highlights is that previous commitments made by the government opposite were to ensure that Labradorians were first and foremost in the development, and that Labrador communities and its people would benefit.

I guess, Mr. Speaker, the reason for the resolution to the floor of the House of Assembly today is because those statements are broad statements. They are broad in the context that they are made and they do not get into the specific opportunities and the specific expectations that Labradorians do receive or do expect to receive as a part of this particular project, and that was my reason for bringing the resolution here today.

I guess there are several things that I want to start, in terms of this discussion. First of all, Mr. Speaker, there will be lots of debate, I am sure, around past deals that were tried to be negotiated or tried to be done. The reality is, Mr. Speaker, that none of it ever, ever happened. The Lower Churchill project today stands as pure and untouched as ever. It has not been developed, despite the years of negotiations, despite the amounts of money spent on cost analysis and studies and recommendations and negotiations. The reality is, Mr. Speaker, that the Lower Churchill project is still not a development in this Province. So, we are still embarking upon a virgin territory in terms of a negotiation, in terms of a new project, in terms of a new development.

So, Mr. Speaker, I want to refer back to a couple of things, and I guess this will substantiate the reasons that I am bringing this resolution forward right now. In 1999, in the provincial election, and I remember it very clearly, it was the position of the Conservative government at that particular time - and I am going to read that because they made these statements and they made them unequivocally in writing as a platform - that they would follow an outline if they were ever to look at this development. This is what they said: the Upper Churchill contract is an arrangement entered into by Newfoundland and Labrador because the Government of Canada would not provide a corridor to get Churchill power outside our Province to markets elsewhere. Ottawa did not treat Newfoundland and Labrador as it treated other provinces. It denied us a power corridor, even though it provided an electricity corridor for prairie electricity and an oil and natural gas corridor for Alberta. Ottawa refused to grant us this corridor, allowing Quebec to exercise its geographic imperative - geographically imperative it would not otherwise have had. Ottawa's decision to deny Newfoundland and Labrador the rights it had extended to other provinces is what resulted in the deal that we got, meaning the Upper Churchill.

It goes on to say that the Upper Churchill deal is in our past but it is also in our future and we have to ensure - another forty-one years remains in the contract before it expires. Because it is Ottawa's failure to extend common rights to Newfoundland and Labrador that caused this deal, therefore it is our position that Ottawa must come to the table prepared to look at ways to fix the deal. The only meaningful way to make amends for the wrong is through compensation.

Mr. Speaker, it goes on to say that this development has to be done with three parties. At that time, they indicated the Quebec Government as one of the parties, including the federal government and the provincial government. It also said that there had to be a right of the wrongs that were created on the Upper Churchill Development Project. That was the policy document of the Conservation Party in 1999.

Well, Mr. Speaker, in addition to that, over the years I guess as the debate continued, there were a number of other statements made with regard to this. Premier Williams, himself, when he stood as the Leader of the Opposition on five different occasions, on August 1, October 24, November 22, November 27 and November 28 - for the hon. members over there who want to write this down so they can research it - made these quotes on a possible Lower Churchill deal. This was all done in 2002, right before the provincial election. This is what he said: If a deal is to be negotiated with Quebec, it must address the inequities of the Upper Churchill; what is believed to be the most lopped-sided agreement ever negotiated in the history of North America.

Well, Mr. Speaker, on five different occasions he said the same thing: I say to those who do not learn from the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them. Nobody wants to see this Province walk away from the only lever we ever have to seek some form of redress for the Upper Churchill. And he said: I will not accept another position.

Mr. Speaker, he said those things on five different occasions, saying to us that there would be no Lower Churchill deal ever signed by him or by his government without there is redress on the Upper Churchill because he feels that in doing so, he would have sold out the only opportunity ever in our history to have the Upper Churchill contract redressed.

So, Mr. Speaker, I take confidence and comfort in those statements, I honestly do. I take comfort in those statements because that, in itself, is a position and a principle that he has set with regard to this negotiation. Well, let me tell you about seven other principles that he has set with regard to this negotiation. The other principles are this, and they were outlined by him on November 22 in a public statement in 2002. This is what the Opposition, lead by Premier Williams at the time, outlined as the most critical points, next to redressing the Upper Churchill Contract, that had to be addressed in the context of a Lower Churchill deal. He said, there is a forty-five year agreement that will expire no earlier than 2055. He wanted that changed. That was one of the goals he had set. He also said that he could not support it without redress on the Upper Churchill, as I just indicated. He also said that he wouldn't be able to support it without a transmission line for power to the Island. That was another one of the conditions. He also said that Quebec, financing the project with money they made from this Province on the Upper Churchill, was not acceptable. He said: There is no guarantee - he wanted to see a guarantee of 100 per cent ownership of the project by Newfoundlanders and Labradorians. He wanted to see a guarantee of 100 per cent management and control of the project by Newfoundlanders and Labradorians, and he also wanted to ensure that our own Province could recall power at a price that was lower than what we were selling it to Quebec.

Mr. Speaker, I agree with every single one of those conditions that the Leader of the Opposition at the time, who is the Premier today, outlined in his statement in the fall of 2002. He said that there had to be 100 per cent ownership in Newfoundland and Labrador, there had to be 100 per cent management and control in Newfoundland and Labrador, he said we have to be able to recall power at a cheaper price than we are selling it into the North American market, he said that we have to have a transmission line for power, he said that we have to have redress on the Upper Churchill agreement, and all of these things, Mr. Speaker, I support and I agree with.

Mr. Speaker, the reason I brought this resolution forward today is, as I said, while all of those statements that were made by the Premier are good and acceptable and I think the uppermost and important in negotiating of this deal, I also think that the benefits to Labrador, in itself, are important. That is the reason I brought forward this resolution today. The resolution itself includes all the points that were presented at a public consultation session held by the government in Happy Valley-Goose Bay just a few weeks ago. It also represents the points that were indicated in a letter from the Combined Councils, the position paper. In fact, Mr. Speaker, the Combined Councils had ten different points in the letter they had sent and the platform that they put out. My resolution actually doesn't go that far in terms of taking in all those points.

Mr. Speaker, I reviewed the platform that was put forward by the Labrador Party in the 2003 election in which they outlined a number of points they would like to have included and addressed as part of the negotiation of the Lower Churchill as it relates to the Labrador portion. I will indicate what all of these are in a few moments and I will speak to them.

Mr. Speaker, the point of the resolution is this: We know where the government stands when it comes to this development as it relates to the Province as a whole, because we heard it from the current minister when he was in Opposition, we heard it from the current Premier when he was the Leader of the Opposition, and we heard it from the Member for Lake Melville. I have hundreds of quotes here from him that I could quote, going back to 2001 and 2002. So we know where the government stands in relation to Newfoundland and Labrador. What we do not know is where they stand in relation to the Labrador portion, and that is why I brought forward a number of these recommendations that were presented by the Combined Councils, that were presented by mayors throughout Labrador, so that we could have a debate and a discussion around them today, just to find out and get a feel for where the government is going as it relates to these particular requests from Labrador.

Mr. Speaker, I am going to start, I guess, by talking to each one of them in particular. One is that: WHEREAS Labrador communities must have electrical power which is affordable and reliable to sustain and grow the local economy. I think every single community that expressed a public opinion around this issue said, unequivocally, that they want to have access to electricity for their communities and for their region, and they want to have it at an affordable rate. I have never heard a community in Labrador say anything but that, and every community's needs are different. The need in Lake Melville is different than it is in the South Coast, the North Coast is different than it is in Labrador West, but all of them said the one thing and that is that they have to have access to cheap available energy. Whether that comes in the form of a transmission line that will run from a Churchill development right through Labrador, whether it comes in the form of alternative power development in various regions, whether that be through other hydro development projects, well then that is what people are asking. That is the request that they are making.

They are also asking that the power be available for industry development. I know it is a key issue in Lake Melville, I know it is a key issue in Labrador West, that there is going to be available power for industry, power that they can access in a timely fashion, power, Mr. Speaker, that they can access and market to industrial customers at a cheaper rate than what it is being sold into Quebec or somewhere else where there is the same kind of industry. That, Mr. Speaker, has been a priority for those particular communities and those regions.

Mr. Speaker, I know there are other alternatives, and I am not going to stand up here today and say that wind power will not work or that solar power will not work or that some other kind of energy development will not work, because the truth of the matter is we are open to look at all the options. We are looking at all the options, all of the possibilities, that can be and should be reviewed as a part and parcel of any new energy developments in Labrador. Mr. Speaker, the people I talk to and the people who were attending the public forums, they really felt that if there is an alternative energy source that can be provided to these communities in as short a time as possible, then it should be done.

Mr. Speaker, I know from my meetings with the Minister of Natural Resources for the Province that he takes this very seriously and he has been looking at these particular options -

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The member's allotted time has expired.

MS JONES: Can I just have a couple of minutes to clue up, Mr. Speaker, and then I will sit right down?

MR. E. BYRNE: Okay, (inaudible).

MS JONES: Yes, just to finish my point.

MR. SPEAKER: Leave to make some concluding comments has been granted.

MS JONES: I am just going to finish my point, because I will get fifteen minutes at the end to say a few words. I just wanted to say that discussions have been ongoing. All of the points that are addressed here with regard to the inclusion of the Aboriginal groups, with regard to the procurement and the employment opportunities for Labradorians, with regard to the environmental assessments and the environmental monitoring that has to occur, with regard to a heritage fund that Labradorians expect, all of these things, Mr. Speaker, were expressed in public consultations, they were provided in writing to government on a number of occasions, and we have had a number of discussions around them already.

I will listen to the other speakers today, Mr. Speaker. I certainly hope they can support the motion that has been put forward, and I will get an opportunity to respond at the end of the day.

Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Government House Leader.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the member putting forward a motion, but I want to put it in some context. Several weeks ago, the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador held the first of what will be many public consultations in Labrador. The Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair was there, the Member for Torngat Mountains was there, and the majority of mayors from her area and across Labrador were there. Many people came there with an expectation that night and it was expressed strongly. At the table, for example, with the Premier was myself, in my capacity as Minister of Natural Resources, the deputy Premier and Minister of Fisheries and Aquaculture, the Minister of Education was also there, the Minister of Human Resources, Employment and Labour, and the Minister Responsible for Labrador Affairs. The expectation that people came to the meeting with was that Premier Danny Williams was about to announce a deal on the Lower Churchill in Labrador. People expressed that night - I am not going to use my opinion here today, I will use the words of the people in Labrador, the people who spoke that night - that they came there expecting that Premier Williams and the government were going to announce an arrangement on the Lower Churchill because that is what they had been used to. That is exactly what they had been used to.

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. E. BYRNE: That is true, members said it there; no question about it.

Let me deal with the pith and substance of what occurred in Goose Bay. Many people said to the Premier: Well, this is a change, this is a first, that this is the beginning of an open consultation process. The member was there. The Premier made a number of commitments to the people in Labrador, a lot of serious commitments.

Let me quote what the Premier had to say: The reason we are here in Labrador, he said, Mr. Speaker, is because this is your resource and we are acknowledging it. Like I said before, this is the first time that this has been done. We, as a government, are coming to you. We want to hear what your concerns are, what you want, what your goals are, what you do not want government to do with this particular resource. This Province has given away your resources in Labrador, this government will not give away this resource. That is our guarantee to you and I can assure you of that.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: Mr. Speaker, the member herself talked about - and I can quote her but I do not need to, I have it in my own mind, I have it all here. It is important. She said: I come here tonight as a Labradorian. I respect that. We were there out of respect for the people in Labrador and for the needs of Labrador. For example, those individuals who were involved - the member is calling for us, in one of her whereas, for example, let me get to it: WHEREAS environmental concerns must be considered and addressed through environmental assessments. Labradorians must be provided with intervenor status.

The Premier made a commitment that night to do exactly that, so that is not a problem. The Premier talked about, and said right up front, we are at least a year away, at least a year away, from making any decisions whatsoever with respect to the development of the Lower Churchill.

He talked about the options that were open to us as a people, as a Province and as people in Labrador. He said there are three options that came out of the Expression of Interest process at the end of phase two, but the one fourth option was an option that we potentially could do it ourselves and that no decisions would be brought forward unless the appropriate amount of consultation took place in Labrador.

For example, I was originally planning to be in Labrador probably after the first week of January but the federal election call has put that out a little bit so it will be the latter part of January. I will be going myself with respect to the Provincial Energy Plan, but in particular -

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. E. BYRNE: I listened to the member intently.

MR. SPEAKER (Fitzgerald): Order, please!

MR. E. BYRNE: Mr. Speaker, I say to the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair, I sat down and listened to her intently. I did not interrupt her. I am just trying to put out our point of view of what transpired. It is her motion. She is the last speaker today. She can wrap up and criticize me or speak to what I am saying. All I am doing is laying out what transpired when we were there.

Mr. Speaker, with respect to the commitments that were made, it was clear. It was clear by the Premier, it was clear by the government. He said we are at least a year away, and we are at least a year away, from making any decisions. We have committed to an extensive consultation process up front. We have committed to providing people in Labrador, and everywhere else for that matter, but in particular in Labrador, with respect to the development of the Lower Churchill, all and any information that they need and require. I, myself, will probably be into four different locations in Labrador, in all areas of Labrador, on this consultation process.

Following my consultation process, Newfoundland and Labrador Hydro are going in behind myself and the government to provide additional information. All of this is an attempt to include the leadership and the people in Labrador into a process to see if there is an opportunity to construct an arrangement that works for the Province but ultimately, as the Premier said himself, works for the people in Labrador.

He asked the people in Labrador that night, and the leadership there, and I think they committed to it, no question. Speaker after speaker committed to the process, that : We are with you right now. We are willing to work with you and your government, Premier, as we move forward. As long as we can commit to, and you commit and are committed to, the open process that we are talking about, then we are with you, to work with you, to see what we can accomplish for the people of Labrador.

The notion was put forward by the member opposite about a heritage fund coming out of Lower Churchill. Do you know what the Premier's response was? If we reach an agreement on the Lower Churchill a year to eighteen months from now, we are still nine to ten years away from the construction of that project. We are still nine or ten years away from the construction and the delivery of electricity, if we reach an arrangement that is acceptable to everybody, and only then would benefits flow.

The Premier said: I do not think we can wait until 2015. We have to come up with an infrastructure plan now for Labrador. We have to talk about transportation infrastructure. We have to talk about: Are there alternatives with respect to the supply of energy for people who are not now accessing renewable energy in Labrador? We have to talk about how we provide upgrades and infrastructure to transmission lines going into Lake Melville, into Lab West from Churchill Falls. We have to look at alternative options on the South Coast of Labrador. Are there other river developments, for example? How can wind play a part in what we are up to? We talked about, for example, the commitments in looking for alternative sources in the Northern part of Labrador; but, Mr. Speaker, those are the things and the commitments that were made by the government.

The member has asked us today to commit to a lot of what we have already committed to, but there are other things, as well, that she is asking us to commit to here. What I say to the member is that this is premature. This resolution is premature. It is asking the government to -

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. E. BYRNE: I say to the member, I listened to her intently. I did not interrupt her. Since I have been on my feet she has been shouting stuff across. If there is anybody who is trying to politicize this process right now, it is the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair. That is what I can say to her.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: That is what I can say to her.

We have made a commitment that no other government since Confederation has made to the people of Labrador with respect to the development of the Lower Churchill, that they will be involved in the process, that there will be extensive consultations, and that we will try to construct an arrangement that works primarily - primarily - for the people in Labrador from the development of the Lower Churchill arrangement.

If you want to say that I am politicizing it, I am not, but I can say this with absolute certainty and with the strength of every bit of conviction that I can muster up right now: It is an approach that, when she was in government, they did not adopt, I can tell you that. I can tell members that, and members opposite know, but that is as much as I am going to say on that because I am not going to belittle the importance of revising or revisiting history, because the people in Labrador know the history of the development of the Lower Churchill as well or better than any member in this House.

Look, I think we need to understand that what the government has committed to, and what I felt that night, and members who were at the meeting can stand up and talk to as well, is that the leadership in Labrador bought into the message that the Premier and the government delivered: Work with us, because we are willing to work with you. Let's work through all of the issues so that we all have the same level of understanding of what the challenges are of developing the Lower Churchill on the one hand, and what the challenges are in meeting the expectations of the people in Labrador on the other. Let's work through alternative options and alternative solutions with respect to power needs.

I will talk about the heritage fund that the member talked about. I will only reference what the Premier said again in Labrador in front of everybody. He said: I do not think we can wait until 2015 to start talking about infrastructure, transportation infrastructure, and infrastructure generally in Labrador; we need to be on to that now. That is why, for the first time since Confederation, this government, not like any other - and any former government was not like the one that came before it - it is our opportunity to do it right, because the traditional approaches have not worked. They have not worked.

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. E. BYRNE: No, and I say to the member, again, who wants to interrupt, there has not been a deal because your approaches did not work.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: That is why we have taken a different route. That is why we, as a government, have put forward an energy plan consultation process that will look out fifty years from now, that will look at how we can become, in this Province, in Labrador and on the Island, an energy warehouse that provides us with the lowest cost power to attract industrial customers on the one hand, Mr. Speaker -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. E. BYRNE: - and, on the other hand, provides for an opportunity for us to generate power and sell to other parts of North America, all with one thing in mind: developing the economy of the Province and providing benefits to the people of Newfoundland and Labrador.

Did we say that we have the energy plan and go out and say, this is it? No, we did not. We say: Here is what we think. Here are the issues that are before us. It is a very comprehensive document, and I encourage all members to participate in the public side of this exercise which will begin in earnest in January and will go on across the Province and in Labrador for a period of time until everyone has had an opportunity, but the view of the government is long-sighted. It is looking out to a point in time - 2041, to be frank about it - when the travesty of the Upper Churchill and that development project comes back, and the benefits associated with it come back, to the people of the Province. That is where we are looking at. That is why we want to put forward an energy plan that works for everybody.

Mr. Speaker, I will not be supporting the resolution today because it is premature. I believe that the member, and I can say, the member got up and said: We are willing to work with you, Premier. If there is one legacy piece, she said, that you can leave - this is her words: If there is one legacy piece that you can leave is to try to bridge the gap. That is what we are attempting to do for the people in Labrador on this resource: To bridge the gap. Members, people who are there from her own district, people who are there from Goose Bay, people who are there from all over Labrador, I believe made a commitment to themselves that night and to us that they were willing to work with the government to move forward because the government has made a commitment to move forward with them in Labrador in an open, honest and forthright way in trying to develop an important resource.

The Premier asked people that night: Will they work with him and the government to do that? We are a year away from making any decisions and this private member's resolution today may form part - if we reach a solution - of what we reach, but, Mr. Speaker, we are not going to tie ourselves in today to commit necessary to all of the below, because, frankly, if we can get to a point in time to reach an arrangement that is acceptable, it may look a lot better than what is on the paper right now.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The hon. the Member for Labrador West.

MR. COLLINS: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I rise today to say a few words on the resolution that is presented to the House by the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair. I have to say that by and large with the resolution as stated, I agree with the resolution as outlined, for the most part.

Mr. Speaker, I have to say that the day for giveaways in Labrador with development is gone. There will be no more of that.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. COLLINS: That day is gone, Mr. Speaker, and people in Labrador for the last number of years have made that very clear, and government has recognized it in the statements they have made, but the proof will be in the pudding, I say, because we had the same guarantees on Voisey's Bay, that Labrador would be the prime beneficiary. But, Mr. Speaker, I can assure you that the problems I have dealt with in my district from people trying to get employment at Voisey's Bay proves to me, in spades, that that deal was not very airtight. There were no hatches battened down on that one, Mr. Speaker. None whatsoever!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. COLLINS: Mr. Speaker, the commitment that was given, when a huge development like Voisey's Bay took place, to the people of Labrador, was that we were supposed to be the prime beneficiaries of such work or opportunities or business opportunities that would arise from that development. With our many people, Mr. Speaker, many people who live in Labrador, who have the training, have the skills for the work that is required in Voisey's Bay and then get a look-in, while there were people from all over this country doing work they were equally qualified to do. That deal, Mr. Speaker, is not one that I will accept for any other further developments in Labrador, and we do have some big ones on our doorstep.

The Lower Churchill and Muskrat Falls are two big developments. No question about it, but there are others that will come on stream before that takes place. One of them that possibly may come to fruition is by a company called Labmag, who proposes to develop a 30 million ton a year iron ore deposit, or production of 30 million tons a year in Schefferville, but it is in Labrador, the mine itself. The ore is within the Labrador boundary. That has great potential if that goes ahead. That will create a huge number of opportunities for people in Labrador and beyond. But, first of all, it has to be for the people who are skilled, who have the ability, who want the jobs. It has to be for them first. As I said, Mr. Speaker, there isn't another time in our history to make sure that happens and no more appropriate time than now.

Mr. Speaker, I agree, and I have been promoting for years, long before I came to the House of Assembly, the concept of a heritage fund, or in mining we call it a depletion fund, but the principle was the same. It was to have a certain amount of money go into a fund that could be used in the event of downturns to help generate many needed jobs that we require at that time, or it could be to promote industrial development within the region of Labrador itself. Something that we certainly, certainly need.

Now, I attended the meeting in Goose Bay as well, Mr. Speaker, and I have to admit, I was surprised with the nature of the meeting and the outcome, because I wasn't expecting a deal to be announced but I was certainly expecting a much, more difficult time for the Premier and his Cabinet than they actually received. I have to say, Mr. Speaker, it was due in large part, no question, to the work that was put into the meeting prior to the meeting itself actually taking place, the background work and meetings with various groups that took place prior to the public meeting that evening. That was probably a strategic and a good piece of planning that enabled that to happen.

Mr. Speaker, the majority of people, the vast majority of people at that meeting, were certainly in favour of what was put forward by government, and the views that the people at the meeting expressed were in sync with each other regardless of what part of Labrador you came from, for the most part. That was that the development as it progresses, first and foremost, has to benefit the people of Labrador, in terms of jobs, in terms of electricity providers, and in terms of the economic benefits that would flow from such a development. That met with the approval of the vast majority of people who attended that meeting.

Mr. Speaker, there was a lot of concern, though, even by people who were in favour of all that was being said. I think you are going to find this concern reflected throughout the Province and the country, as projects of this magnitude take place, and that is the concern expressed over environmental issues. It is an area where we have to go carefully. The announcement at the meeting was that the special interest groups, groups that had a cause for environmental concerns, that funding would be made available for them to carry out and conduct the research to make sure we have the correct view of environmentalists and other concerned residents as to what was taking place would not be harmful or destructive to the environment, in the way that the Upper Churchill development was when that took place, with the flooding of hundreds of miles of territory. A lot of the burial grounds, Mr. Speaker, that the Innu had and that they travelled for years as their trapping grounds are now under water. That was a disaster, something that I don't think would ever be allowed to take place in this day and age.

Mr. Speaker, I think we have a lot of pressing needs in areas of Labrador. I know in Labrador West we certainly need extra electricity for industrial development, and we need to have a new transmission line run from Churchill Falls over to Labrador West that would facilitate the additional electricity required in the event that a major industry, that is a high consumer of electricity, decides to relocate. It is an attractive tool for marketing, it is an attractive tool for attracting investors to come to your area of the Province, make a sizeable investment, and employ the people who live there.

There are other areas as well, Mr. Speaker, that are lacking, certainly, in electrical needs. I think of areas along the South Coast, the Straits and up the North Coast. It is absolutely ridiculous the rates that the Member for Torngat mentioned yesterday in the meeting we had with the Combined Councils. Those are rates that nowhere else, not in the Province and I would say probably nowhere else in the world, people are paying. It is absolutely outrageous that communities, as close as they are to probably the largest hydro development producer and electricity site in the world, or certainly one of the largest, are paying that amount for electricity in that close proximity to the largest hydro development. There are other industries along the South Coast and the Straits that have to shut down at certain periods during the day because of the peak in electricity; they cannot operate.

All of that, Mr. Speaker, has to be corrected in order for communities to develop and progress as they should be able to. There are many ways of doing that, Mr. Speaker; many ways. Hydro electricity from the Lower Churchill is one. Another way to do that, Mr. Speaker, is the development of rivers within the areas that the electricity is needed. Wind power is another example that could be used to generate electricity that may be able to meet the needs of the people who live in the areas where electricity is in short supply right now.

Mr. Speaker, the heritage fund that this resolution calls for, I think is a novel idea. It is a good idea and it is one that could benefit Labrador, in particular, where this development will take place. It could really benefit areas of Labrador by having a pool of money used for local development. Mr. Speaker, I do not think that is a lot to ask. For many years, since the development of the Upper Churchill, we have seen billions of dollars leave this Province and flow to the Province of Quebec. We have seen, Mr. Speaker, the sale of 127 or 130 megawatts of power, what we have called recall power, being sold on the main line out through to the Province of Quebec.

Mr. Speaker, what we need more than anything in Labrador today is new transmission line capabilities that go from the West to the East, and local developments in other areas of Labrador on the North Coast, South Coast and in the Straits area, that will meet the demands of the people who live there, both for residential and business purposes.

Mr. Speaker, this resolution calls for many, many things and I know the Government House Leader, the Minister of Natural Resources, said, that maybe there can be a better resolution than this once they get further down the road towards reaching a deal on the Lower Churchill. For today, Mr. Speaker, I will support this resolution, and if what the Government House Leader says, in fact, turns out to be correct, that there can be a better deal, then we can certainly amend this resolution to accompany that as well.

On balance, Mr. Speaker, I do support the resolution as presented by the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair. I certainly hope, for the benefit of all people in the Province, particularly those in Labrador, that this project does proceed in a timely fashion, so that we can all reap the benefits that a project of that nature will bring.

Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Lake Melville.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. HICKEY: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

It is indeed a pleasure to get up and speak to the people of the Province, to this hon. Assembly, but, in particular, to speak to the people of Labrador.

I want to take a couple of minutes, Mr. Speaker, to talk about my involvement with Hydro, my knowledge of it. I grew up on the Hydro project, one of the very first Hydro projects in Labrador, I am proud to say, the Twin Falls Power Corporation. Then, that was the powerhouse that supplied power to the communities of Wabush and Labrador City until the early 1970s. Of course, when the Upper Churchill came on power, the community was closed down and we were moved to Churchill Falls. I am happy to say, that I spent a lot of my childhood growing up years in that community.

I know, Mr. Speaker, the aspects and the importance of hydro development in Labrador. Having worked with hydro for twenty-five years, I certainly understand the project and I understand the challenges and I understand what one has to do in order to build a hydro project.

What I find interesting about this Private Member's Motion, Mr. Speaker, is that my hon. friend, the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair, is putting this in place now when she was at a meeting in Happy Valley-Goose Bay and heard the commitments on behalf of the Premier of the Province, heard the commitments on behalf of the government on this side of the House, and heard what people in Labrador had to say. I must say, Mr. Speaker, it was indeed a great session. It was indeed said to the people of Labrador, that this government, this Premier, is going to have a new approach on this particular project. We have seen the faults of the past. I can say to my hon. member across the way, that indeed she was a part of two governments that tired to do this project, and on both counts failed. I can also say, with all confidence, Mr. Speaker, that this particular member, to the best of my knowledge, never produced anything like this document when she was on the other side of the House, when she was a Minister of the Crown.

Mr. Speaker, this is about politics. This is about spreading gloom and doom across the big land. Oh, the government of the day is going to take our resources and sell them off to Quebec! I can tell you, Mr. Speaker, that under the leadership of this Premier, under the leadership of this Minister of Natural Resources, under the leadership of this government, that the people of Labrador will be served.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. HICKEY: Finally, Mr. Speaker, once in our lives we are going to receive the benefits of our resources for the benefit of Labrador, Labrador communities and Labradorians.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. HICKEY: I can say to the hon. member across the way, she is politicizing this knowing full-well that this government is committed to a process. This Premier has taken a new approach. I can tell you, Mr. Speaker, the people of Labrador, certainly from what I have heard and the feedback I have gotten, like the approach that this government is taking.

We are in the very early stages of this project. The hon. member talked about a heritage fund. Let me say, Mr. Speaker, truly the time for investment in Labrador in infrastructure is not 2015. The time is now, and I am proud to say, Mr. Speaker, that this government has started major steps in Labrador to look at the infrastructure needs.

I can talk just to the Town of Happy Valley-Goose Bay, and the fact that we are working diligently and I see success coming, certainly early in the new year, when we talk about the new auditorium, when we talk about $4 million or $5 million, whatever is needed to put that new expansion onto the College of the North Atlantic, Mr. Speaker, so that we can train Labradorians before the project stops, not after the project stops, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. HICKEY: Not like what happened with Voisey's Bay. We were sold down the tubes by the hon. Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair and the then Member for Lake Melville and the then Member for Torngat Mountains, on Voisey's Bay. We found that out very clearly, Mr. Speaker, when the communities of Happy Valley-Goose Bay, Labrador West and Cartwright were not included in any agreement with government by Voisey's Bay Nickel for jobs and for the communities that we were promised by the companies under the leadership of the government of that day.

I can tell you, Mr. Speaker, Labrador and Labradorians and Labrador communities are going to have every opportunity - every opportunity, Mr. Speaker - to have their say, to have their input. I can tell you, the meeting we had in Happy Valley-Goose Bay with Aboriginal people on this project, we are working closely with the Innu Nation and President Ben Michel. We are going to work closely with the Labrador Metis, and they are going to be involved in the consultation process. The Premier has already, on two occasions, expressed a view to the Metis to meet and to talk about this. The President of the Metis, Mr. Chris Montague, has chosen not to meet, but that invitation is open. We want to hear from all peoples.

Early in the new year, the Minister of Natural Resources will travel throughout the Province and indeed all regions of Labrador as we talk about a new energy plan - a new energy plan for the Province, and a new energy plan for Labrador. At that time, we encourage again the opportunity for Labradorians and Labrador communities to have input into what their expectations are and what the reality is when it comes to electricity, electrical needs, and indeed electrical rates. I have no trouble, Mr. Speaker, in talking about this, particularly in light of the fact that the people on the North and South Coast of Labrador pay some of the highest electricity rates anywhere in the Province of Newfoundland and, indeed, as my hon. colleague from Labrador West mentioned earlier, probably anywhere in the country. That is going to change, Mr. Speaker. That has to change.

There are a number of opportunities, both on the North Coast and South Coast of Labrador, where we can look at putting real jobs, real development, developing rivers in those particular areas. I can tell you, we look forward to working with the new Nunatsiavut Government on the North Coast as we look at some of the challenges and issues that are going to be dealt with up there regarding hydro power.

I can tell you, we are going to work with the Combined Councils of Labrador. We just had meetings here this week, just yesterday morning, with the Combined Councils of Labrador, and we talked about the issues on the South Coast. There are a number of rivers on the South Coast of Labrador which we could develop to provide jobs in Southern Labrador, for young people in Southern Labrador, with hydro projects.

Mr. Speaker, my hon. friend and colleague, the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair, can politicize this however she likes but, I can tell you, we are not going to support it. I am not going to support her plan, because we saw her plan in the past. We have a new plan. We have a new direction with new leadership and a new approach that this government is going to move forward on to ensure that this project happens, but, Mr. Speaker, that it happens in the best interests of Labradorians and Labrador communities. That is what this member wants!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. HICKEY: Mr. Speaker, when we talk about investment - I want to take a few minutes - presently we have interests from a number of key investors in resources in Labrador. We have investors who are now looking at the new Lab megaproject over in Labrador West. We have investors who will be coming to my district next week and I will be meeting them there to talk about an opportunity of a mine in the Churchill River, a mine that will create, into full production, somewhere in the vicinity of over $250 million worth a year of economic activity, Mr. Speaker.

I can say to you that electricity is going to be a key component of this development, but I can also tell you that the message has gone loud and clear to investors: We want the full secondary processing of our resources done in the communities adjacent to these resources. We want the maximum benefits for these communities, no matter where they are in Province.

I can say to you, I looked forward to travelling with these investors as we came to meet with the Premier and the Minister of Natural Resources last week and as we move forward on some of the very interesting and exciting things that are happening in my district, and indeed in Labrador, that will create much wealth for this whole Province into the future, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, this is a very, very important project. This is a very, very important project. It is a very, very important issue for me and for my district. I want to say this very clearly: As we move forward with this project there are going to be lots of opportunities for people to have their say and to express their views on this particular project, but I can tell you the message I am getting out of Labrador is that, at this present point in time, the majority - the majority, I say, Mr. Speaker - of the people from Labrador are in support of this project and this development, but it has to be done, certainly, in a way - and the commitment has already been made by the Premier - that all questions regarding this project will be looked at.

The Premier, at the meeting in Happy Valley-Goose Bay that the Minister of Natural Resources alluded to earlier, gave a commitment there on the floor that intervenor status will be given to anyone and everyone who wants to become involved in this process so that they can do it through the EIS process, so they can get the funding to be able to do the study and to research the issues that they are concerned about. The Premier gave that commitment on the floor - on the floor.

Mr. Speaker, I believe that the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair is politicizing this particular issue, as she often does. I will say to you that this here, this private member's motion, I will not be supporting it. I just simply will not allow the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse Clair to put her plan on the table. We have seen her plans in the past and, I can tell you, I am not interested in seeing her plans for the future.

We have a plan here for this project, Mr. Speaker. This Premier has the leadership and the wherewithal and the approach to be able to do this project, to do this project properly, but we are going to prepare ourselves. We are not going to leave the young people of Labrador until the day we are turning on the switch at Gull Island and say we are going to train you now for jobs. We are going to do that earlier. We are going to make sure that the College of the North Atlantic has the courses and the training available to Aboriginal and non-Aboriginal youth in Labrador, so they can take full benefits of the Lower Churchill Project and the construction of the same, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, last week, a few days back, the Premier of the Province sent a letter to the Prime Minister, and in that letter to the Prime Minister he talked about energy. I say to the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair, if you want to lobby someone, lobby your federal cousins in Ottawa to give us a hand to help out with the construction and the transmission of power on the Lower Churchill deal, I say to the hon. member. And I say to you, Mr. Speaker, the Premier has indicated very clearly that we want to know what the Prime Minister of the country thinks about this. We want to know what the Leaders of the Opposition parties think about this, and that is why the letter was sent and that is why we are waiting a response from the federal parties.

Energy is a very, very important aspect of development in Labrador. It is very important to the forest industry. It is very, very important to the mining industry. It is very, very important to community development, and I would say to you that this government, this Premier, this caucus, this MHA, is committed to a very public consultation. I can tell you one thing we will not do, Mr. Speaker, we will not travel to Churchill Falls with the Premier of Quebec without consulting anyone and try to sign a deal.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. HICKEY: And the last thing I will say, Mr. Speaker, we will not put everybody into the Aurora Hotel in a board room at the eleventh hour, fifty-ninth minute, when everything is all signed, sealed and delivered and try to shove it down Labradorians' throats! I can tell you that, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

AN HON. MEMBER: With the video already made.

MR. HICKEY: With the video already made, Mr. Speaker, we will not do that.

I will say to you, and I encourage all Labradorians to become involved with the many processes that are going to take place over the course of the next twelve to fourteen months on this very, very important project for the people of Labrador and their communities.

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Torngat Mountains.

MR. ANDERSEN: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

It is certainly a pleasure to rise today and speak on the resolution put forward by the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair, which I believe was outlined in the Upper Lake Melville area, and the Member has put her resolution forward to bring it before the House. I know I will stand and support it.

Mr. Speaker, there is no question about the need to consult and how we develop our resources. I travelled - the same day that the Premier had a meeting in Happy Valley-Goose Bay, I was in the community of Postville that afternoon and going back to Goose Bay that evening. A lady in Postville showed me her light bills, her monthly light bills starting in January, 2005. Mr. Speaker, she and her husband and her family own a four-bedroom bungalow. They have a fridge, a stove and a television. They do not use electricity to heat their home. The cheapest light bill that she had for the whole month was in the month of August, and that was $309. Three hundred and nine dollars and we look at the Upper Churchill - and, of course, no one in this House was around when that deal was made. People on the South Coast of Labrador and on the North Coast live within a 250-mile radius of the mighty Churchill Falls, yet we pay the highest electricity costs probably in all of Canada. Yet, we (inaudible) the Eastern Seaboard.

Mr. Speaker, I listened to the Member for Lake Melville speak and the only remarks, I will say to him, was with the Voisey's Bay deal in my riding. There were two Aboriginal groups who signed IBAs with Voisey's Bay Nickel and the Labrador Inuit Association who worked the deal with the Province. Without the two Aboriginal groups agreeing to the IBAs and to the documentation with the government, then no project in Voisey's Bay would have gone ahead.

Mr. Speaker, I invited the Minister of Natural Resources to travel to the North Coast this past summer and, certainly, I know that it was impossible for him to do so, but I hope that he will travel to the North Coast as well - I am sure he will - to meet with the new government. On the North Coast of Labrador there are four of five rivers which I believe the new government, in conjunction with the federal government or this Province, can certainly develop to provide the North Coast with good and cheap electricity rates.

With regard to the Churchill project, Mr. Speaker. Again, in own my mind, the question is there: Do we spend a billion dollars or hundreds of millions of dollars to put a transmission line to the North Coast, or do we provide a better subsidy? Different people on the North Coast have pondered that for quite some time, but no doubt that when the development of the Lower Churchill comes on stream then certainly the key part is going to be people, and no doubt that there are going to be many, many major developments in Labrador, particularly in my riding. There are three or four mineral deposits that is worthy of mentioning that pretty soon could start to be developed. That is going to be done in conjunction with the new government, Nunatsiavut, and certainly it will give them a very strong bargaining tool with the provincial government, with the federal government working hand in hand to, in some cases, do joint ventures. Certainly, that is going to be a big plus for the people on the North Coast.

Government's commitment to people, I can only say that being the member for the North Coast of Labrador since 1996, that I am proud of the work I was able to achieve under the Liberal government with our schools and our roads, fish plants - it goes on. No doubt that this government has done some wonderful things, too. I am sure with the new government that they will continue to do so. I want to thank the Minister of Aboriginal Affairs for many joint ventures that they have already done with the coastal communities. In Rigolet, for example, there was work that was done.

Mr. Speaker, when we come down to developing our resources in Labrador, there is a cry from the people in Labrador. Let's do this developments with people in mind. I can only say that I was a member of the past government, and I can say today here that I made my concerns very, very clear as to what I would like to see unfold when the time comes for me to publicly stand and support the deal that was on the table at that time. Mr. Speaker, I will say it again, I was very vocal in the caucus room with the minister and the Premier of the day, as to what I wanted to see, particularly for the North Coast of Labrador, to offset the high cost of electricity rates.

Mr. Speaker, the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair, again, has put this forward, I think, with all good intentions. What was said in Happy Valley-Goose Bay is brought forward here in this motion. I did not speak at the meeting in Happy Valley-Goose Bay. I know the other members from Labrador did, but, for me, for my own personal reasons, I thought it was better for the people up in Labrador to speak. That was my choice.

Mr. Speaker, there is no doubt that the resources need to be developed - and, Mr. Speaker, let me say this - not just for Labrador but for the Island portion of this Province as well. If we can begin a process of working together and developing our resources - Mr. Speaker, I think it has been said many, many times: Why do we have people on welfare?

We can blame, I guess - I take responsibility for being a part of the past government, but there were other governments before. I know, Mr. Speaker, from the North Coast of Labrador, with this new government, there are going to be many, many new initiatives that are going to be debated.

Let me say to the Minister of Natural Resources, I look forward to him making a trip in there next summer, and to all of them. Who knows, Mr. Speaker? Down the road - no one knows how long a stay is in politics, but let me say this - maybe I can be a member of a government that will work with the Province and the federal government to bring about new initiatives and certainly make Labrador what it is supposed to be.

Again, Mr. Speaker, to me, the deal has to be about people. There was a lot of talk about infrastructure. No doubt it is very important, but we have to find a way to provide the people in Coastal Labrador with a good source of cheap electricity.

By the way, Mr. Speaker, the cheapest light bill for the lady in Postville was $309. I checked my light bill, and the highest light bill for me living in Goose Bay was $59.71. That was for the month, I think, of October.

Mr. Speaker, I support the resolution put forward by the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair. Certainly, I commend the government for travelling to Labrador. I look forward to the minister again travelling to all regions of Labrador, and certainly in his new role of not just talking to the residents on the North Coast of Labrador but, far more important, talking to members of the new Nunatsiavut Government.

Madam Speaker, thank you very much.

MADAM SPEAKER (Osborne): The hon. the Minister of Fisheries and Aquaculture, and Minister Responsible for Aboriginal Affairs.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. RIDEOUT: Thank you, Madam Speaker.

AN HON. MEMBER: (Inaudible).

MR. RIDEOUT: Madam Speaker, I am being jostled by my friends on the other side.

I do want to take a few minutes this afternoon, Madam Speaker, to make a few comments, not as much on the resolution, I suppose, because I do not think the resolution adds anything to anything, to be honest with you, but the development of the Lower Churchill, that is another matter, Madam Speaker. I think that is a subject that is fit for debate not only in this House but in this Province pretty well any day of the week.

Madam Speaker, this government embarked, as part of our new approach, we embarked on the possibility of developing this resource in a way that I do not think any government in the previous history of this Province ever undertook. It was a totally open, accountable, new approach to the development of a major resource in this Province, never undertaken before, Madam Speaker. I believe that says something, or ought to say something. I think it does, in fact, say something to the people of Labrador.

We called for proposals worldwide. Whoever wanted to could come to the table, pick up the package. If you are interested, if you see an opportunity here, if you see a business opportunity, have a look at it, let us know; and, of course, we will do a proper due diligence. We will do an appropriate analysis of what your plan is. If we like what we see, if we like what you are talking about, there is a possibility of short listing you here. Once that is done, what are we going to do next? We are going to go and talk to the people who are most impacted by this.

Madam Speaker, I can tell you that I was very, very proud to go into Labrador, into Happy Valley-Goose Bay, with the Premier, with my colleague the Minister of Natural Resources, the Member for Lake Melville, the other members from Labrador, the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair. I think all Labrador members were there, actually. I do not know if there were other Cabinet ministers, but we went in and we began the consultation approach where, Madam Speaker? In Labrador. We did not send it out by the Net. We did not send out a pamphlet. We did not ask people to write us a letter on the back of a cigarette pack, or something of that nature. We went to the people most directly concerned and who would be most directly impacted by this agreement. We consulted various groups in the community and then we had a public meeting.

We said, right directly up front: This is only the beginning. This will not be the last consultation. We want to hear you, the Premier said. The Premier said: This is your resource. I am standing here in front of you as the leader of the government of this Province, telling you I want to hear from you. My ministers are here with me. Caucus is here with me. This is your first opportunity to tell us what you think. There will be many others, but this is the first opportunity.

That is a new approach to resource development in Newfoundland and Labrador.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. RIDEOUT: I wish we had that approach back in the Upper Churchill days, Madam Speaker. There are many other resource developments that took place in this Province, if we had taken that kind of approach - listen to the people approach, hear what the community has to say approach, give some weigh to that approach - then I think perhaps governments would not have fallen into the kinds of traps that we have fallen into historically in this Province in resource development.

That was the beginning, Madam Speaker. We spent three or four hours, maybe longer, letting every group from every place in the Big Land who wanted to say a word, say it. We responded when it was appropriate, and then went on to the next group.

We will go on doing that, Madam Speaker. There is no rush. This is not to be a rushed, done in the closet, backroom type of deal. If this deal gets done at all - and I believe it will; I believe there is a good possibility of this deal getting done - if it gets done, it will be done in the open, accountable light of day. It will be transparent. It will be done with the full advice and input of the people adjacent to the resource. It will be done taking into account, Madam Speaker, their wishes for economic opportunity to come from it. It will be done with a view to making sure that the greatest economic impacts possible are felt by the people of Labrador.

That is what we want to do, Madam Speaker. We want to do a development that is good, first of all, for the people of Labrador; and, hopefully, as a result of it being good for the people of Labrador, it will be good for the people of the Province as a whole. That is what we want to do.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. RIDEOUT: Madam Speaker, practically every WHEREAS and every item that is included in this resolution is now a matter of public policy by this government and public comment by this government. This resolution adds nothing, as I said in the beginning, only it allows for an important debate to take place, and in that context it is okay.

In terms of new ideas, in terms of a new vision, in terms of a new approach, in terms of bringing something new to the debate and to the discussion, it has all been done. This has all been identified by this government, by the Premier, by his ministers, in consultation with the people of Labrador. What is in this resolution, Madam Speaker, we heard it in spades on the floor of the auditorium in the College of the North Atlantic in Happy Valley-Goose Bay.

We are committed, Madam Speaker, to the principles that are in this resolution. We have put them in front of the people, we have heard them from the people, we have said that is exactly the approach we are going to take, and we are going to continue to develop them, to refine them, to make them into any agreement if there ever is going to be an agreement. That is what we have done, Madam Speaker, as a government. I was proud to be part of that. I was proud to be with a Premier who has made those commitments to the people of Labrador. We do not need any political camouflage in the form of a resolution to make us do the right thing for the people of Labrador, Madam Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MADAM SPEAKER: The hon. the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse aux Clair.

When the member speaks she will close debate.

MS JONES: Thank you, Madam Speaker.

I cannot believe the rhetoric I am hearing in this House of Assembly today. I cannot believe it, Madam Speaker. I sat in a room, in a public session, for several hours with three of the speakers who spoke today on the opposite side of the House of Assembly, sitting at the front table, committing, Madam Speaker, to every single point that is in this motion, committing in that room, in that public forum, to the people of Labrador, openly, Madam Speaker, that, yes, we will honour those commitments. That is what they said, Madam Speaker.

Let me read these into the record, because the people who were in that room that night know, the Member for Labrador West knows and the Member for Torngat Mountains knows. He was there, I was there, Madam Speaker, the three speakers from the government side of the House, the Minister of Natural Resources, the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs and the Member for Lake Melville, were there. Do you know something, Madam Speaker? I brought this resolution into the House of Assembly non-political, in good faith. In good faith, Madam Speaker!

I am going to read this because here in this information I have a number of other requests as it relates to this development, but they are not in this resolution. Do you know why they are not in this resolution, Madam Speaker? Because they were not committed to by the government, and I did not put them in the resolution because I wanted the government members and all the members in the House to support this resolution. They chose to make it political, they chose to do that.

Let me just read to you. It says: Labrador communities must have electrical power which is affordable and reliable to sustain and grow the local economy. Well, let me tell you, the Premier sat on that stage and committed that the energy needs in Labrador had to be addressed. In fact, he went as far as to say they have to be addressed even before there is a Lower Churchill deal, because that could be ten or fifteen years down the road. It was on every single news cast in the Province, I say to the government members; every single news cast.

Let's look at the other one. The other one says that they would expect to have a heritage fund. Do you know what the Premier said? We don't need to wait until there is a Lower Churchill deal to have a heritage fund to do infrastructure work in Labrador. We can start doing that now, we can start putting that together now. What do we have today? We have the members opposite today who are not as brave as their leader, not as brave to stand up in this Legislature and support it today, are they, because someone might hold them to it down the road. That is the problem, Mr. Speaker. Do you know something? They can put the heritage fund in place. Do you know why they can put the heritage fund in place?

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER (Hodder): Order, please!

MS JONES: Because they are collecting $50 million in profit today on the recall power on the Upper Churchill, $50 million of Labrador money going in the back pocket of the provincial government. Mr. Speaker, there is absolutely no reason in this world -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

I ask members to my left if they would permit the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair to make her speech. She has a limited amount of time, fifteen minutes, and she is approaching the halfway mark. I ask members for their co-operation.

The hon. the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair.

MS JONES: If you want to turn it around, I will turn it around for you.

Mr. Speaker, they can put the heritage fund in place. They can put it in place tomorrow morning (inaudible) -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please! Order, please!

 

The Speaker just asked for the co-operation of all members and I want to do that in the manner we always do it. In other words, the Speaker will ask and members will give other members the attention that they deserve. However, I do ask members if they have differences to take them outside the Chamber. We are listening to the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair.

The hon. the Member.

MS JONES: Mr. Speaker, they can put a heritage fund in place tomorrow morning. Do you know something? All they have to do is give Labradorians back their own money. That is what they have to do, Mr. Speaker. They have $50 million in profit they have collected. The Member for Lake Melville, you can scream and act like a buffoon all you like, it makes no difference to me, I say to the hon. member; no difference to me.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS JONES: I will not be bullied in this House by the Member for Lake Melville, Mr. Speaker.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS JONES: I will not be bullied in this House.

I am going to tell you, Mr. Speaker, the member ought to sit in his seat and act as an honourable member should or be asked to leave this House. I am trying to make a statement.

Mr. Speaker, they can start by giving Labradorians back their own money. That is what they can do. The $50 million in profits on the Upper Churchill deal would make a lovely heritage fund for the people of Labrador, I say to the hon. members, a fund that they committed to on the stage in Goose Bay only a few weeks ago.

Mr. Speaker, the other thing in this motion asks for consultation with the Aboriginal people. They stood in the House this week and said - the Minister of Natural Resources told me himself - they were already in dialogue with the Innu Nation. The Premier told me in Goose Bay, as soon as the court challenge with the Métis people has been concluded they would be more than prepared to sit at the table with the Métis people. The commitment was made, I say to the hon. members.

Lets look at the other thing in this motion. The other thing says that there should be local business procurement and local employment opportunities, all of which they had already agreed to, Mr. Speaker. The other thing in the motion that they want to vote against, everything which they had previously agreed to, the other thing is the environmental concerns must be addressed and then through environmental assessments. On the floor of the auditorium in Goose Bay, they committed to money to do environmental interventions as part of this assessment. They committed to it, Mr. Speaker, they put money to it, right there, right then.

Today, Mr. Speaker, we are in this Legislature with a motion that says all of those things-

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

I have to remind the hon. Member for Lake Melville, that if he continues to interrupt the Chair will have no choice but to ask him to leave the Chamber while the member continues her speech.

MS JONES: Mr. Speaker, do you know something? Do you know what the other requests were? Let me just tell you, these are the things that are not in the motion. Do you know why they are not in the motion? Because the Premier and his Cabinet had not committed to it in Goose Bay. I would not put it in the motion because I did not want to politicize this, so I left it out. Everything that was in the motion was what they committed to.

Here were the other things: That there would be a plebiscite taken in Labrador. I did not put in the motion because it was not committed to. The other thing was that they would have a transportation fund as part of the deal. It was not committed to, so I did not put it in the motion. The other thing is that they would open the constitution regarding section 92(a) of the Upper Churchill Agreement. Mr. Speaker, it was not committed to in that meeting so I did not put it in the motion.

Mr. Speaker, I was being fair and looking for legitimate support for the people of Labrador just to say these are the things discussed, these are the things committed to, bring it to the House of Assembly, let's vote on it, let's work together, because, Mr. Speaker, I believe that if we are going to prosper in this Province we need to be able to work together on developments like this. But, do you know something, Mr. Speaker? I was absolutely appalled here this afternoon. Absolutely appalled! You can probably tell by the tone of my voice, because I usually do not get upset. I usually don't, but when I do something honestly, in good faith and with all sincerity, and I have such a negative, such a politicizing, such an arrogant response to it, Mr. Speaker, it absolutely appalls me; it does.

I am going to tell you something. Do you want to make all of this political? I will make it political. I have absolutely no reason not to make this political at this point, because the Member for Lake Melville stands up here today, Mr. Speaker, talking out of both sides of his face. I never heard such riddling jargon in all my entire life from a member of this Legislature.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS JONES: But, let me tell you something, I can stand on my record in this Legislature and in Labrador any day of the week with the member opposite!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS JONES: Any day of the week, Mr. Speaker, with the member opposite. I can guarantee you that!

MR. HICKEY: (Inaudible).

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS JONES: Mr. Speaker, he gets up there and talks about the commitment to Labrador. Well, I have not seen it, sir. I have not seen it from your government. Where were you on the base file when the federal government had to come in and save the jobs in Goose Bay and save the base? Where were you when they moved the ferry services down into the minister's district in Lewisporte and shut down a rural economy in Labrador? Where was the government when four fish plants closed in my district and 500 workers were laid off this summer? Not one of you over there opened your mouth! Not one of you!

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MS JONES: Not one of you opened your mouth to save a job in the rural area. The Member for Lake Melville can laugh and he can laugh and he can laugh, because I am going to tell you, Mr. Speaker, this member has no record to stand on in this Legislature or in Labrador, and I can guarantee you, Mr. Speaker, this member will not hide away in Labrador and hide away from the issues and hide away from the people. Indeed, I will not, I say to the hon. member, and you can laugh all you like, but I am going to guarantee you one thing: when the people in my district were put out of jobs, when their fish plants closed down, they did not laugh. They did not laugh, I say to the hon. member. They were anything but laughing.

Mr. Speaker, that is all this is about. Do you know what this is about? Because I am an Opposition member in Labrador who brings a motion to this Legislature, and do you know something, Mr. Speaker? They are so arrogant in their thinking and in their ways that they cannot support it because it was brought in by an Opposition member in Labrador. Isn't that ridiculous? There is the partisan that exists in the government opposite. How can you openly listen to other people? How can you openly listen to their views and their perspectives when they cannot even support a motion that summarizes every single thing they committed to themselves because it is brought in by a member on the other side of the House of Assembly? That is how small all this is about. Absolutely ridiculous!

Mr. Speaker, I am going to tell you something. I am going to tell the Member for Lake Melville something. He has no monopoly on issues in Labrador. He has no monopoly on where people want to go and where they are prepared to go to fight for the issues that are important to them. I am going to tell him that. There are three more members in this House who are able to stand on their feet any day of the week, I say to him, and represent the people of Labrador. Absolutely, any day of the week.

I am going to tell you something, Mr. Speaker, what has happened here today is absolutely nothing short of ridiculous. It is disrespectful, in my mind, to the people of Labrador. Absolutely, disrespectful to the people of Labrador. The people of Labrador who came out -

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

MS JONES: Mr. Speaker, the Member for Lake Melville and the Minister of Transportation and Works, or the Minister of Fisheries and Aboriginal Affairs, have not been quiet for one minute since I have been on my feet this evening. Not for one minute, and I think that is absolutely disrespectful. I am trying to make a point on a very important motion and I have been unable to make my points effectively, simply because of the haggling of the people on the opposite side.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

The House of Assembly is a place where members are encouraged to make their points of view. We all make our presence here in the passing of laws and presenting the views of our constituents. Certainly, the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair is making a very passionate speech. That is to be encouraged. I ask all hon. members if they would show co-operation and also show respect for the request of the Chair. The Chair has requested that members be very co-operative and understanding.

The Chair recognizes the Member for Cartwright-L'Anse au Clair.

MS JONES: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I am going to conclude my comments because it is obvious that the members opposite cannot take the facts. That is the problem here and that is why they have not been able to sit back and listen to the points that I have been trying to make in this motion.

This is a very serious motion; a very serious motion brought here in good faith on behalf of the people of Labrador, I will say to you. I walked into that public consultation - and I disagree with the Minister of Natural Resources, no one was going there to tear the government apart. No one was going there expecting that a deal was done. In fact, it was quite opposite. Every single person that I met with, including the dozen or more from my district, went there with prepared speeches in good faith outlining their wish list and what they expected from the government. I am absolutely appalled today to hear that they were going there expecting everything was done and that they were going to take on the government, because that was not the case. Maybe the word was put out by certain people, but very false I say to the members opposite; very false. The people went there in good faith and they spoke honestly and they spoke from the heart. This motion was meant to do absolutely nothing, only express their views and their perspectives that was expressed that evening in that room and was committed to by the government.

Mr. Speaker, I hope that members would support this motion. I hope they would. I hope that the government would stand on the words and the commitments that they made in that room that night and would stand up and support this, because I am going to tell you, it is meant in good faith, as the comments of the people in Labrador are meant in good faith. I can only ask that they would reconsider and support this when it is called.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

MR. SPEAKER: Is the House ready for the question?

AN HON. MEMBER: Yes, Mr .Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: All those in favour of the motion on the resolution, please say ‘aye'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Aye.

MR. SPEAKER: Those against, ‘nay'.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Nay.

MR. SPEAKER: The Chair rules that -

AN HON. MEMBER: Division.

MR. SPEAKER: Division has been called.

Call in the members.

Division

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

Are the Whips ready?

AN HON. MEMBER: Yes, ready.

MR. SPEAKER: All those in favour of the motion, please rise.

CLERK: Mr. Reid; Mr. Butler; Mr. Barrett; Mr. Langdon; Ms Jones; Ms Thistle; Mr. Andersen; Mr. Sweeney; Ms Foote; Mr Joyce; Mr. Harris; Mr. Collins.

MR. SPEAKER: All those against the motion, please rise.

CLERK: Mr. Rideout; Ms Dunderdale; Mr. Ottenheimer; Mr. Hedderson; Mr. Sullivan; Mr. Jack Byrne; Mr. Shelley; Mr. Fitzgerald; Ms Sheila Osborne; Mr. O'Brien; Ms Burke; Ms Whalen; Mr. Jim Hodder; Mr. Hickey; Mr. Wiseman; Mr. French; Mr. Young; Mr. Hunter; Ms Johnson; Mr. Ridgley; Ms Goudie; Mr. Skinner; Mr. Oram; Ms Elizabeth Marshall.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Oh, oh!

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

CLERK: Mr. Speaker, twelve ayes and twenty-four nays.

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please!

I declare the motion lost.

This being Wednesday, this House now stands adjourned until tomorrow at 1:30 of the clock in the afternoon.